Tremulous Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: freezway on November 28, 2010, 11:15:51 pm
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It seems there has been a lot of hoopla recently about an "HD tremulous". I want to state a few things:
- "HD" mean high definition and commonly refers to a screen resolution of 1280x720 or higher
- Tremulous is NOT switching engines for the 1.2 release
- An engine switch would be a monumental amount of work
- Closed source engines (source, ungine, etc.) are out of the question
- In trem 1.2, there WILL be new sounds (http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=13257.0), new weapon models and skins (http://janvanderweg.com/pics/tremulous/) , possibly a new human model [unconfirmed], and "choppers" (http://janvanderweg.com/pics/tremulous/choppersig.jpg) for aliens
Can we PLEASE stop making topics about this! Now that's not to say if you create a really high res texture of model that you shouldn't share it, it just means stop making topics saying: "We should create a high res trem and put it in a new engine."
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A* HD Tremulous
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STICKY.
NOWActually, missing something- the official release date is set for Thursday.
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- Tremulous is NOT switching engines for the 1.2 release
We know it.
- An engine switch would be a monumental amount of work
Not so much. I think there was at least one 'rude' port - XReal Trem port. More work with textures/maps/models than with coding actually.
- In trem 1.2, there WILL be new sounds (http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=13257.0), new weapon models and skins (http://janvanderweg.com/pics/tremulous/) , possibly a new human model [unconfirmed], and "choppers" (http://janvanderweg.com/pics/tremulous/choppersig.jpg) for aliens
Different sounds/models/skins can be found in trem 1.1 too on some servers/patches.
Can we PLEASE stop making topics about this! Now that's not to say if you create a really high res texture of model that you shouldn't share it, it just means stop making topics saying: "We should create a high res trem and put it in a new engine."
Some peoples want some engine/etc improvements for Tremulous. Why they cant talk about it?
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simply put, the topics are beginning to repeat themselves. I'm talking about the main trem 1.2, not unofficial servers.
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- An engine switch would be a monumental amount of work
Not so much. I think there was at least one 'rude' port - XReal Trem port. More work with textures/maps/models than with coding actually.
That port hasn't even made it to a pre-alpha stage yet. It's vaporware.
Can we PLEASE stop making topics about this! Now that's not to say if you create a really high res texture of model that you shouldn't share it, it just means stop making topics saying: "We should create a high res trem and put it in a new engine."
Some peoples want some engine/etc improvements for Tremulous. Why they cant talk about it?
If they have ideas, that's what they should make the topic about. Otherwise, we're looking at a crapflood of duplicate "OMG WEN 1.2?" "I CAN HAS HD PLX?!" and the like.
(Slightly) off-topic: It's true that Trem's textures don't exactly look good (due to the low resolution), and I wouldn't mind a new set (1024x1024 would be nice). If that's the problem, then please say it is, rather than talking about "HD" like it means anything more than "dynamic" or "synergy". Why do people keep abusing these words?
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No one forcing anyone read topics they dont like. Not so many 'hd tremulous' topics to count it as topics spam. Im not happy about so many dream discussions too, but i think its ok anyway.
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That port hasn't even made it to a pre-alpha stage yet. It's vaporware.
Im not saying it was real and ready project. It was fast try, but it work some way. Its proving that porting is real and not so hard.
If they have ideas, that's what they should make the topic about. Otherwise, we're looking at a crapflood of duplicate "OMG WEN 1.2?" "I CAN HAS HD PLX?!" and the like.
(Slightly) off-topic: It's true that Trem's textures don't exactly look good (due to the low resolution), and I wouldn't mind a new set (1024x1024 would be nice). If that's the problem, then please say it is, rather than talking about "HD" like it means anything more than "dynamic" or "synergy". Why do people keep abusing these words?
Dont be a slave to a words, they just talking about 'HD', but mostly they mean 'better graphic' imho. And high-res texture sets is not solution. Too heavy load on engine, huge size and poor result.
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That port hasn't even made it to a pre-alpha stage yet. It's vaporware.
Im not saying it was real and ready project. It was fast try, but it work some way. Its proving that porting is real and not so hard.
The "monumental amount of work" that freez was referring to has barely been started yet. So far, nothing has been proven, and nothing will be until it's at least playable, which won't happen for a while.
If they have ideas, that's what they should make the topic about. Otherwise, we're looking at a crapflood of duplicate "OMG WEN 1.2?" "I CAN HAS HD PLX?!" and the like.
(Slightly) off-topic: It's true that Trem's textures don't exactly look good (due to the low resolution), and I wouldn't mind a new set (1024x1024 would be nice). If that's the problem, then please say it is, rather than talking about "HD" like it means anything more than "dynamic" or "synergy". Why do people keep abusing these words?
Dont be a slave to a words, they just talking about 'HD', but mostly they mean 'better graphic' imho. And high-res texture sets is not solution. Too heavy load on engine, huge size and poor result.
First point: I'd say throwing the latest marketing buzz-word around, without having a clue what it means, makes someone more of a "slave to words" than someone who understands that word, and says what they really mean.
Second point: At a certain point, no matter how good the engine is, better graphics will get you further. Throwing a few lens flares and dynamic shadows (for example) onto, say, the original Metal Gear Solid (which wasn't very well-detailed, to put it lightly), will not magically make the textures look sharper.
Basically, I want a new engine too, and I'm not going to argue about how outdated ioq3 is (almost a decade?), but it's not something a handful of independent people can slap together in a few days. If it was, the developers wouldn't be debating about it, and someone would have done it already. Look at all the other people who want a new engine, at least one of them should be competent enough to pull it off, right?
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Well, i agree with you in some moments. =]
But about engine... I think main problem not 'we have no peoples who can make it' or 'it too hard for realise'... Peoples just dont want make such work because developers will never include they work in official project, thus no point waste time on thing that even wont be used. I remember somewhere on forum a lot of peoples offer help and ready pieces of work, but... without any success. Sad, but truth. =\
UPD: We have coder in our clan, who maked improved InstaGib mod for Trem from scratch. Main reason he gave for not implement new engine: 'I checked code. Client-side should be changed. I can do it, but we have no any way to deliver this code to players'
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It does seem to be getting silly, maybe the existing HD Trem threads could be merged in some way?
CATAHA, it's all well and good people offering to help, at the moment no one seems to be in a position to project manage a graphical overhaul of trem, though. As always, i'd be interested to see the ready pieces of work that have been rejected by the devs.
oh ffs, the pointless discussion has spread to this thread too now, don't post those pieces here, post them back in the existing trem HD or ideas for 1.3, or a similar thread :-\
A* HD Tremulous
?
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I was not going to do this here. And i have no right now some ready pieces, that was just explanation of 'why it not done yet'. =]
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Well, i agree with you in some moments. =]
Sometimes I agree with you too.
But about engine... I think main problem not 'we have no peoples who can make it' or 'it too hard for realise'... Peoples just dont want make such work because developers will never include they work in official project, thus no point waste time on thing that even wont be used. I remember somewhere on forum a lot of peoples offer help and ready pieces of work, but... without any success. Sad, but truth. =\
Here's the thing: Porting a game to a different engine would probably mean creating a fork, or a different project based on it. So, for example, someone could make an XReal fork and call it "XTrem" or something. What I'd imagine happening is that someone gets XTrem to work, just to prove that it can happen, and then the developers merge the changes back in if they feel like it. It looks like it's the "if they feel like it" part you're worried about, but if XTrem or whatever works, they'd probably be more likely to, since it can be done.
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Here's the thing: Porting a game to a different engine would probably mean creating a fork, or a different project based on it. So, for example, someone could make an XReal fork and call it "XTrem" or something. What I'd imagine happening is that someone gets XTrem to work, just to prove that it can happen, and then the developers merge the changes back in if they feel like it. It looks like it's the "if they feel like it" part you're worried about, but if XTrem or whatever works, they'd probably be more likely to, since it can be done.
In this case easier to make separate game, than 'fork' project. In any case such huge engine upgrade demand at least new maps, and they wont be compatible with default trem maps. So... we got new engine, and new maps. Ok, lets imagine we leave models, sounds, etc... We can try leave same server-client protocols, but anyway this server will work properly only with 'XTrem' client. =\
Thing you offering just cant happen, because its more than just a piece of code, which devs can include if they like it.
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That sounds a bit like a fork to me.
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r_width 1280
r_height 720
/vid_restart
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Profit um i mean HD tremulous no need to change engines or even assets
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If it got to XReal they'd/we'd copy whatever GPP changes are made and keep it in tune unless the guy in control of the port didn't like it. If you have a game that plays identical to Trem and works just like Trem with more visual "bling" then people will switch unless there is a glaring issue.
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I laughed so hard when I saw the choppers. That would slow down the dretch quite a lot