Tremulous Forum
Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: Sixthly on March 03, 2012, 11:14:25 am
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Hello fellow Tremulous lovers. I am a TremZ developer who was recruited by volt.
I would like to make it very clear to everyone that volt has overthrown the project and banned myself, cron, and many other developers from the project for the reason "Traitor":
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19689620/volt/Screen%20Shot%202012-03-03%20at%208.52.46%20PM.png
A month ago when I was originally contacted by volt he asked me to help him overthrow the TremZ project. He started by removing Ishq and cron's access from the dedicated server and forum. He then asked me to transfer all of the server data to a new server and then delete the original data. I did not do this. Instead, I started interacting more with Ishq and the other developers and stopped communicating with volt altogether. Fortunately his plan to kick all project members that disagreed with him did not go through at the time. Unfortunately it appears he is now successful.
This whole time volt has been working in secret on a different, equally unstable codebase. The other codebase solely relies on all bug fixes that we make. The purpose of the alpha release this month was to accelerate development and find bugs. The alpha release has served this purpose and we have made dozens of bug fixes planned for release on Monday:
* Mouse sensitivity will now function correctly.
* Added automatic fallback support for computers that do not support GL3.
* BuildSkeleton will no longer fail and flood the console with messages.
* /register and /unregister will now function correctly.
* The binding interface will now function correctly for Dodge, Sprint, Secondary Attack and Use Structure/Evolve.
* Added ALT+TAB support for Linux and Mac. Additionally, ALT+TAB will now function correctly on Windows.
* Lines that end with a "^" character will now function correctly.
* Maps that rely on stock Tremulous 1.1.0 maps will no longer have missing assets.
* ALT+ENTER will now function correctly on Mac.
* The console on the vanilla renderer will now be displayed properly.
* Cheat protection has been removed from r_mapOverBrightBits, r_overBrightBits and r_vboModels for players with driver issues.
* Holding down three or more keys will no longer flood the console with messages.
* The console now supports all 32 colours. Additionally, black is a dark grey for readability.
* The rifle bullet casing will now display correctly on the vanilla renderer.
If we had waited an additional several months for volt's UI and HuD the game would have been equally unstable because we need a user base to help us find bugs. volt has a distorted understanding of what an alpha release is, and wants to continually delay the project for a UI and HuD that he is working on in private and will not share with anyone.
Now about HermXIV. HermXIV is one of volt's puppets. A blind follower. HermXIV organised our website hosting and has now blocked all of us from accessing it. Additionally, he is threatening legal action if we restore a backup of the website with a new host because he legally owns all of the data, including posts, accounts, wiki and blog entries. Unfortunately it looks as though we will have to start a website from scratch with a new domain name.
I hope that order is soon restored.
Regards,
Sixthly
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ALL HEIL VOLT!
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Yes I am Hitler for not supporting a fork, I am Dr. Evil.
All hail Der Führer! lol
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* Mouse sensitivity will now function correctly.
* BuildSkeleton will no longer fail and flood the console with messages.
* Added ALT+TAB support for Linux and Mac. Additionally, ALT+TAB will now function correctly on Windows.
* Maps that rely on stock Tremulous 1.1.0 maps will no longer have missing assets.
* The console now supports all 32 colours. Additionally, black is a dark grey for readability.
This pleases me.
Please let this be released regardless of anything else that happens.
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Just to be clear, nobody ever decided to fork. Volt kicked everyone out and claimed that we were forking.
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You joined the project a couple weeks ago. You have very little insight into what has happened or what is going on. We hope to bring the teams back together, but for now they are separate entities. You have some false claims there, but I won't point out.
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In the interest of transparency, here is everything that happened leading up to this in our dev channel:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6915364/%23tremz-dev.log
This is 3 hours worth of painful drama, but if you want to see for yourself what went down, it's all there.
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You have some false claims there, but I won't point out.
You spread too much bullshit around, but I can't tell which of this overly large heap is yours.
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All what I see is kids arguing over the toys on sandbox, so to speak.
And I hope this is one big shitty joke that already shook me badly.
If not, good riddance. I am not giving any support for projects where devs can't pull the same rope.
And sorry for my part of drama, but this really shocked me.
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"I am not giving any support for projects where devs can't pull the same rope."
Well said.
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Additionally, he is threatening legal action if we restore a backup of the website with a new host because he legally owns all of the data, including posts, accounts, wiki and blog entries.
I didn't realise he felt so strongly about protecting intellectual property.
Yes I am Hitler for not supporting a fork, I am Dr. Evil.
I shouldn't have to explain this one.
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Additionally, he is threatening legal action if we restore a backup of the website with a new host because he legally owns all of the data, including posts, accounts, wiki and blog entries.
he does not legally own any of the data, with the possible exception of the forum's skin design, which is crappy anyway. in any case, there isn't really anything useful on the forums and the wiki.
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http://dl.dropbox.com/u/42962918/voltvskharnov.txt
Context: last December, volt ragequit the project. He came back eventually, and since I was the first to be vocally against volt, our new (and current) project head Ishq tried to mediate things between me and him. Of course, at the time, we couldn't foresee just what volt was up to, but from the log there, you can see a few particular traits of his personality.
(09:01:50 PM) volt: 3. Yes, fuck the community all 210 of them.
(09:02:13 PM) volt: They don't deserve this, they are insluting, imature and have not paid a single cent for this game.
(09:02:20 PM) volt: This game is for us the developers first and them second.
(09:02:32 PM) volt: Whey the hell else would be creating this if it wasn't for us first?
(09:02:40 PM) volt: I'm developing so *I have something to play*
(09:20:53 PM) volt: You have to be selfish to develop
(09:21:11 PM) volt: your work has to be about what you want and what is possible with your skill set.
(09:21:37 PM) volt: I started this with the sole intention of doing it all on my own and recieved a tremendous amount of help which I'm thankful for.
(09:21:48 PM) volt: This project will always be for the developers first and the community second.
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http://dl.dropbox.com/u/42962918/voltvskharnov.txt
Context: last December, volt ragequit the project. He came back eventually, and since I was the first to be vocally against volt, our new (and current) project head Ishq tried to mediate things between me and him. Of course, at the time, we couldn't foresee just what volt was up to, but from the log there, you can see a few particular traits of his personality.
(09:01:50 PM) volt: 3. Yes, fuck the community all 210 of them.
(09:02:13 PM) volt: They don't deserve this, they are insluting, imature and have not paid a single cent for this game.
(09:02:20 PM) volt: This game is for us the developers first and them second.
(09:02:32 PM) volt: Whey the hell else would be creating this if it wasn't for us first?
(09:02:40 PM) volt: I'm developing so *I have something to play*
(09:20:53 PM) volt: You have to be selfish to develop
(09:21:11 PM) volt: your work has to be about what you want and what is possible with your skill set.
(09:21:37 PM) volt: I started this with the sole intention of doing it all on my own and recieved a tremendous amount of help which I'm thankful for.
(09:21:48 PM) volt: This project will always be for the developers first and the community second.
Please don't try to tell me you think the tremulous community is a *good* one. I think the MOBA games have a nicer people playing them... Which is sad. I think in a way you do have to be selfish to dedicate yourself to a project too. You need to want it, if you don't you need to get paid. Otherwise it just doesn't work.
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After spending an hour and a half reading that IRC log I can now sum it up for everyone in a paragraph or so.
Sixthly, Kharnov, Cron: VOLT YOU STOLE SOME PICTURES
Volt: No I didn't (lies probably)
-Discussions continue, on the stolen stuff line
Volt: Kharnov, you are proven clinically insane.
Kharnov: WHAATT
-Incessant raging by both sides
-Camps develop.
Cron & Co: Volt and Herm have been working on a secret database THEY NOT ALLOWED TO DO ANY WORK ON ANYTHING BUT UNVANQUISHED
Volt and Herm: Actually yes we can since you aren't paying us and we can work on whatever week like.
-Raging continues
Everyone: This is all your fault. We didn't start this argument and now look at this shitstorm. We should stop before it gets out of hand.
Volt: Kharnov doesn't do anything for this project. Why did we recruit someone who is clinically insane?
-Raging continues
Herm and Volt: We did so much work with this project and most of you guys just sit on the IRC and do nothing.
Everyone: We need to work this out with ishq before everything falls apart.
-Server and forum action is taken. Accounts are banned, Unvanquished team denied action, etc.
Herm: I want this team to get back together but we should wait two days for ishq to mediate this and until then I am taking all the sensitive information.
THE NEXT DAY
In #unvanquished-dev (This is just my approximation I really have no idea what happened here)
Herm: I am sorry for my harsh words last night. But not my actions.
Unvanquished team: HATE HATE RAGE RAGE RAGE
LATER (on tremz-public)
Herm: *Sigh.... * This sucks...
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There was a lot more raging than that involved but mostly it was just pointing fingers and stuff.
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Always new Volt was a fag..
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Always new Volt was a fag..
Typical Aussie Assault comment is typical
I mean sure mistakes have been made, but lets not go ahead and call volt obscenities because you are unhappy with tremz, when he was the one who started it in the first place.
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Always new Volt was a fag..
Typical Aussie Assault comment is typical
I mean sure mistakes have been made, but lets not go ahead and call volt obscenities because you are unhappy with tremz, when he was the one who started it in the first place.
Don't associate Jimzombie with Aussie Assault.
Nobody there likes him.
With that being said you also play there.
Volts action do seem very selfish, It doesn't seem he gives two shits about the community.
It was also interesting to find out that a lot of volts work is indeed just copied and edited: http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=16503.0
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thumps up volt is a faggot loser who has no life
:tyrant:
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Don't associate Jimzombie with Aussie Assault.
Nobody there likes him.
With that being said you also play there.
Typical doesn't necessarily apply to everyone, but considering that this topics twin on Aussie Assault forums is half full with volt hate, I don't think my claim is incorrect.
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long ago, i kept telling dushan1 to stop committing unprofessional and retarded changes to the OpenWolf code repository, because i felt the need to review as much changes as possible, and it was an everyday frustration to read his crappy, disorganized, undocumented, name-tainted, and buggy changes. i once opted to partially revert 1 commit which had a pack of his retarded changes. this resulted in commit wars, after which dushan removed my commit permissions from the repository. as a result of that, i left the team, and said that i would come back only if dushan were banned. apparently then, some people have forked from the OpenWolf repository, and so the dushan the retard continued to work on OpenWolf alone, but apparently volt went with him in secrecy. (i didn't actually come back for additional reasons.) and now we're seeing volt's spectacular actions, which are backfiring.
btw, to anyone interested, the project's repository was first located on Assembla, then on SourceForge, and now there are 2 separate projects, one on GitHub (the GOODTM one) and the other one on BountySource. During each relocation, the full history of commits were erased. however, i still have the full history of both the Assembla and SourceForge repositories, and can provide them upon request.
DEFINITION: the normal state of the TremZ/Unvanquished is the state before i left: dushan was committing retarded changes to a repository, there were a total of 3 active code committers (which includes me), the development was slow, volt was stealing and including more and more copyrighted material, etc.; there was one team, but the project was going nowhere in time.
Herm: *Sigh.... * This sucks... I just want everything to be back to normal now...
you've gotta be fucking kidding me. you want us, GOODTM developers to keep up with mr. dushbag's retarded changes, and allow volt's copyright-infringing assets to be released with the game?
1 my shift key tends to disfunction when attempted to be used to capitalize certain faggots' names
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Can I hand napkins to the people who are busy eating themselves?
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mr. dushbag
*dustpan
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I never said this:
Herm: *Sigh.... * This sucks... I just want everything to be back to normal now...
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This is just pathetic. Here I was happy thinking that this game was moving forward. I guess my flaming of Tremulous and it's sucktard faggot devs were well deserved. FUCK YOU ALL!!!
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I never said this:
Herm: *Sigh.... * This sucks... I just want everything to be back to normal now...
Alright, I'll take that off, but that's the impression I got from reading about a page of chat with someone (can't remember)
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long ago, i kept telling dushan1 to stop committing unprofessional and retarded changes to the OpenWolf code repository, because i felt the need to review as much changes as possible, and it was an everyday frustration to read his crappy, disorganized, undocumented, name-tainted, and buggy changes. i once opted to partially revert 1 commit which had a pack of his retarded changes. this resulted in commit wars, after which dushan removed my commit permissions from the repository. as a result of that, i left the team, and said that i would come back only if dushan were banned. apparently then, some people have forked from the OpenWolf repository, and so the dushan the retard continued to work on OpenWolf alone, but apparently volt went with him in secrecy. (i didn't actually come back for additional reasons.) and now we're seeing volt's spectacular actions, which are backfiring.
btw, to anyone interested, the project's repository was first located on Assembla, then on SourceForge, and now there are 2 separate projects, one on GitHub (the GOODTM one) and the other one on BountySource. During each relocation, the full history of commits were erased. however, i still have the full history of both the Assembla and SourceForge repositories, and can provide them upon request.
DEFINITION: the normal state of the TremZ/Unvanquished is the state before i left: dushan was committing retarded changes to a repository, there were a total of 3 active code committers (which includes me), the development was slow, volt was stealing and including more and more copyrighted material, etc.; there was one team, but the project was going nowhere in time.
Herm: *Sigh.... * This sucks... I just want everything to be back to normal now...
you've gotta be fucking kidding me. you want us, GOODTM developers to keep up with mr. dushbag's retarded changes, and allow volt's copyright-infringing assets to be released with the game?
1 my shift key tends to disfunction when attempted to be used to capitalize certain faggots' names
this tells me my first assumption was essentially right. the "custom" engine is really just openwolf with frankencode cut-n-paste additions. combine that with stolen art and other assets (remember the sound issue, the "main stumbling block of releasing 1.2"? those are reproduced in full as well)
this is almost as entertaining to watch as the nexuiz split.
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my first assumption was essentially right. the "custom" engine is really just openwolf with frankencode cut-n-paste additions.
what is the OpenWolf engine?
what is the Xreal engine?
what is Tremulous' engine?
what is the ioQuake3 engine?
what is Quake 3 Arena's engine?
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my first assumption was essentially right. the "custom" engine is really just openwolf with frankencode cut-n-paste additions.
what is the OpenWolf engine?
what is the Xreal engine?
what is Tremulous' engine?
what is the ioQuake3 engine?
what is Quake 3 Arena's engine?
iD tech3, basically re-written iD tech 2?
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lol
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my first assumption was essentially right. the "custom" engine is really just openwolf with frankencode cut-n-paste additions.
what is the OpenWolf engine?
what is the Xreal engine?
what is Tremulous' engine?
what is the ioQuake3 engine?
what is Quake 3 Arena's engine?
iD tech3, basically re-written iD tech 2?
did you just answer only the last of multiple, consecutive questions, like retards typically do?
i'll save you the time -- each said engine is really just the next said engine with frankencodeTM cut&paste additions.
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my first assumption was essentially right. the "custom" engine is really just openwolf with frankencode cut-n-paste additions.
what is the OpenWolf engine?
what is the Xreal engine?
what is Tremulous' engine?
what is the ioQuake3 engine?
what is Quake 3 Arena's engine?
iD tech3, basically re-written iD tech 2?
did you just answer only the last of multiple, consecutive questions, like retards typically do?
i'll save you the time -- each said engine is really just the next said engine with frankencodeTM cut&paste additions.
commentless namespace and naming convention conflicting code lifted from a wiki or another project or a wiki of another project?
(edit, missed a word)
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commentless namespace and naming convention conflicting code
no, frankencodeTM.
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commentless namespace and naming convention conflicting code
no, frankencodeTM.
oh, i see now, i was not using the term in the same sense you were.
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So, just to check, I would probably assume that it's parts taken from multiple bodies of code and crudely stitched together without full understanding of the overall process, something of that sort?
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So, just to check, I would probably assume that it's parts taken from multiple bodies of code and crudely stitched together without full understanding of the overall process, something of that sort?
that may very well be the case, judging by the retardedness of the mover code in the g_mover.c file of the Quake 3 Arena source code.
the said case is surely true for open-source derivatives in the engine chain, based upon the fact that many unprofessional freelancer programmers worked on the engines.
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Can I hand napkins to the people who are busy eating themselves?
Unfortunately well said.
I've said it before, I'll say it again. The tremulous community is sadly the worst Gaming community I've ever seen. Filled with big ego's and mouthy flamers. Maybe the Flamer should be the Tremulous Communities icon, not the goon, or the granger.
It's really sad when the community (volt included, since he was part of the tremulous community before being tremz dev) can't work together for a common aim. It's also sad when developers join a "team" and start trying to enforce their will on the team leader, or team originator. Equally sad is when the leader won't take suggestions for improvements.
This whole mess was months in the making, and I feel sorry for Isch (hopefully got the spelling right) because it looks like it would have happened whether or not he took a break for a couple days or not.
Going through all that's said, all I see is a lot of big, hard-headed egos too proud to admit mistakes. If that offends you, then maybe you are one of those egos, go look in a mirror first before flaming me.
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The Tremulous community is far better than that of TremZ and Unvanquished though. People here don't try to be nice, people don't try to honey-coat things. They are just direct and harsh and don't expect a release, whereas these new communities do.
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The Tremulous community is far better than that of TremZ and Unvanquished though. People here don't try to be nice, people don't try to honey-coat things. They are just direct and harsh and don't expect a release, whereas these new communities do.
This pretty much sums up my preference to this community, but for the word 'nice'. The nicest people I know are blunt and forthright because they care. This is why I wouldn't sugarcoat the act of 'sugarcoating' itself by calling it 'nice'.
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I may not agree with everything Volt has done, but I think it's in fairly poor taste to compare a guy, who was pressured to get a game he's not getting paid to do done really fast, to fucking Hitler. God damn. That dude killed millions of people, brutally. I'm not defending anyone here, just come up with better insults. Shit.
tl;dr get a life.
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So, just to check, I would probably assume that it's parts taken from multiple bodies of code and crudely stitched together without full understanding of the overall process, something of that sort?
that may very well be the case, judging by the retardedness of the mover code in the g_mover.c file of the Quake 3 Arena source code.
the said case is surely true for open-source derivatives in the engine chain, based upon the fact that many unprofessional freelancer programmers worked on the engines.
huh. i would have thought they had a "clean and professional" codebase, on an assumption. oh well. you know what they say about assumptions.
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Filled with big ego's
and grammar mistakes.
Going through all that's said, all I see is a lot of big, hard-headed egos too proud to admit mistakes. If that offends you, then maybe you are one of those egos, go look in a mirror first before flaming me.
name at least 1 triplet, which is strongly related to this thread, of a person, his/her mistake, and the corresponding thing to admit. (do not include your grammar mistake.)
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Sixthly, since you're speaking for Unvanquished, would you mind explaining why I'm currently banned from #unvanquished even though I've never been there?
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Sixthly, since you're speaking for Unvanquished, would you mind explaining why I'm currently banned from #unvanquished even though I've never been there?
#unvanquished has existed many years ago, long before the TremZ project was even planned to begin. maybe you were there long ago and were banned for whatever reason. #unvanquished was the discussion channel for the then-planned 3rd race mod. however, recently, TremZ was stupidly renamed to Unvanquished.
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If I'd done something to get banned there, I would remember it.
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You will be unbanned as soon as I get back. I have no idea why you would be banned.
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Ah, thanks.
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It's really sad when the community (volt included, since he was part of the tremulous community before being tremz dev) can't work together for a common aim. It's also sad when developers join a "team" and start trying to enforce their will on the team leader, or team originator. Equally sad is when the leader won't take suggestions for improvements.
I agree with this fully. Fortunately our loss was minimal in the end so development will not be affected too much once we are back on track. The main thing that threw us off was the seizure of infrastructure. This time we have a project head hosting the infrastructure.
Don't misunderstand, as much as we all wanted to work together, all it took was someone contributing something significant to block our access when they disagree in order to ruin relationships. I'm sure you can understand the situation.
I may not agree with everything Volt has done, but I think it's in fairly poor taste to compare a guy, who was pressured to get a game he's not getting paid to do done really fast, to fucking Hitler. God damn. That dude killed millions of people, brutally. I'm not defending anyone here, just come up with better insults. Shit.
The reason I associated volt with Hitler is because he has turned the project into a dictatorship, not because I believe that volt is a mass murder or because I am trying to insult him. It was an analogy. Now that I look back, it was a pretty poor analogy. Regardless, the reason behind the analogy was If you are a developer and disagree with volt then you are banned as a "Traitor", no matter what contributions you have made or are actively making.
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see Godwin's law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law).
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see Godwin's law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law).
isnt there a law about how quickly godwin's law will be invoked?
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see Godwin's law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law).
isnt there a law about how quickly godwin's law will be invoked?
:police:
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btw, to anyone interested, the project's repository was first located on Assembla, then on SourceForge, and now there are 2 separate projects, one on GitHub (the GOODTM one) and the other one on BountySource. During each relocation, the full history of commits were erased. however, i still have the full history of both the Assembla and SourceForge repositories, and can provide them upon request.
So this explains the EASILY noticeable odd sudden "first commit". Its easy to tell by checking the history, and looking at the logs and see what the source code looks like there. Now, everyone hates volt. Nice going.
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btw, to anyone interested, the project's repository was first located on Assembla, then on SourceForge, and now there are 2 separate projects, one on GitHub (the GOODTM one) and the other one on BountySource. During each relocation, the full history of commits were erased. however, i still have the full history of both the Assembla and SourceForge repositories, and can provide them upon request.
So this explains the EASILY noticeable odd sudden "first commit". Its easy to tell by checking the history, and looking at the logs and see what the source code looks like there. Now, everyone hates volt. Nice going.
… what?