Tremulous Forum
General => Feedback => Topic started by: PHREAK on January 06, 2007, 06:52:27 pm
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Well since my original post about this got lost in the move, I'm posting this again.
As many of you know, the current version of the strongest weapon in game, the Lucy, is better at killing dretches and promoting spam as well as camping rather then taking out large aliens.
My suggestion for a new weapon attempts to introduce a weapon with a sole purpose of taking out goons and tyrants.
While it can be use for all classes, the bigger the alien, the bigger the chance for greater damage.
My idea is an energy weapon that shoots 5 balls in a rather wide formation with no or very little spread.
Formation would be circular or star shaped, spaced so that only one ball can hit a dretch at one time. As useful in taking out bases as a shotgun.
Here are some stats:
-5 balls each doing 20 DMG
-refire rate a tad slower then shotgun (requires good movement and dancing thus preventing it from being overpowered)
-6 shots in a clip, fairly long reload time (promotes precision and prevents the weapon from being overpowered)
-after a set distance, the balls "poof" or explode, creating a 120dmg detonation point (sweet spot)
This range dependency makes the weapon extremely unsuitable for spam and camping but rather good at fighting tyrants and goons as well as defending in critical situations.
-Projectile speed is about 2.5x that of the pulse. (I'm very open about this; I want the projectiles to be very fast but not hitscan)
-Weapon is rather large and heavy, thus slowing down the bearer. Bsuit cancels out the weight.
-not affected by battery pack (set amount of shots per clip and clips per load)
One thing I'm unsure of is the amount of clips in a load.
If it's too few, it would discourage attacks away from base.
If it's too many, it might be a tad overkill.
Inspiration for this weapon came from the anti aircraft Flak as well as the Crylink from Nexuiz (some of you might be familiar with it; This is Crylink on steroids :wink: )
So to sum up:
Every ball in the round does 20 DMG/100 combined.
No spash damage.
The poof itself is a 120 explosion with no shrapnel. Not sure about the size yet.
So 6x100=600 per clip or 720 if you manage to ride the sweet spot which is highly unlikely.
Also, drethes have 25 hp.
This would allow a dretch to eat 1 ball and still live with 5 hp.
However, the larger the alien, the bigger the chances of all balls hitting thus dealing large amount of damage.
The spacing would make it very unlikely to kill a dretch in one shot.
As far as the poof effect goes as well as the range dependency, this is to discourage spam as well as make this weapon unsuitable for chases yet promote skill and a tad of luck in close combat. Chaiguns do a great job chasing. I personally don't wish to decrease the use and need of a chaingun.
The speed is very open to me. My goal is to make the projectiles very fast yet not hit-scan. I agree that only testing of the weapon will determine the correct, balanced speed for it. Nothing is set in stone :wink:
If the feedback is positive, I'll code it, attempt to model it and release it.
I'm not a sensitive person so don't hold back. I'd rather have constructive criticism but feel free to flame if you have to.
Go wild.
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I really dont see why you cant use a battery pack with it since its a laserish gun :\ and it also sounds like this gun will be to shotgun as lasgun is to rifle. More accurate, deals more damager per shot, but fires slower.
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The reason for the set ammo is not to make the weapon overkill.
I guess things like this need to be tested ingame.
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you can make it have 5 shots and 7 with battpack like the md...but i really dont think you should make it exempt from battery packs just cuz itll be over kill :\ i would hate to see that happen to pulse <3
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the devs don't like to give upgraded forms of weapons, and your suggestion is a "super shotgun" i like the idea, as it takes skill, but it probably won't make it in unless they delete the existing shotgun
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The only similarity of this gun with the shotty is the firing mode.
Shotties are great for dretches, basis, maras and if you are skilled, goons.
This only does decent damage to goons and tyrants.
It does not replace the shotty under any circumstances.
The weapon is also extremly ranged due to the FLAK effect.
In it's current vision, it's not similar to any weapon in game.
@n00b pl0x
You do realise that this weapon can kill 1 tyrant and one goon in 1 clip.
Adding 2 more shots to the clip would make it simply too much.
Thanks for the feedback guys.
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you do realize 1 goon and 1 tyrant could kill a bsuit in less than 2 secs
and you suggested 6 shots per clip, but i suggested 5 per clip and 7 with batterypack. thats only one more per clip. besides this is going to be an s3 weapon right? It should make you choose between ammo and armor like luci does. And considering how only one can hit a dretch at a time, this is how it would work for other aliens mostlikely:
dretch-2 shots (1 hit each time)
basi-3 shots (2 hit each time)
mara-3 shots (3 hit each time)
with a long reload and a long pause between shots i dont really see the problem with a batterypack.
also, keep in mind dretch are completely free, and that they can just keep dretching at you for 0 evos while ur holding something that costs...well you didnt say a price...but i would expect it to be more towards the expensive side of the spectrum than not.
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Sounds like an energy version of anti-aircraft flak rounds.
Not a bad idea, actually.
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I like the idea, good thinking.
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Fuel rod cannon from halo2:
http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Fuel_Rod_Cannon
"It is magazine fed ... with each cartridge holding five rounds. The gun fires fairly fast, and reloads at around the same rate as the rocket launcher."
Sounds much like modified version of the same gun for me... That gun would be just like fuel rod shotgun.
Super Munchkin:
Ultimately unbalanced destructivity etc (http://www.sjgames.com/munchkin/img/game_cover.jpg)
Btw...
/"/""\"\
\"\""/"/
\\:.V.://
Copy and paste Granger into your signature! I thought it was a reactor...
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A weapon that spreads out, making it sometimes hard to kill small aliens, but perfect for larger ones: The Chaingun.
And usually only first-rate goons can handle a pair of shotguns.
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I like the idea a lot. The only problem I can foresee is someone figuring out the exact distance to a certain point so that the balls explode there, and then spamming (e.g. the door above human default on Karith)
A weapon that spreads out, making it sometimes hard to kill small aliens, but perfect for larger ones: The Chaingun.
The gun doesn't spread more over time, if I read correctly. It just fires the balls spaced at a constant distance.
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As many of you know, the current version of the strongest weapon in game, the Lucy, is better at killing dretches and promoting spam as well as camping rather then taking out large aliens.
Since you base you suggestions on a faulty assumption, you fail.
You should have written that you have trouble using Luci, and therefore you mostly just fire it at the ground hoping to kill Dretches with the splash damage.
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@Lava
If you'd kindly re-read what you quoted from my post, you'd notice that I never claimed that lucy can't kill tyrants or goons.
I simply pointed out that it's better at killing dretches and smaller aliens as well as the fact that it promotes camping and spam.
Try to comprehend a post before you reply to it.
I'd also like you to know that my lucy skill is rather decent at taking out goons and tyrants without spam and floor shots.
Either way, if you don't see an issue with the current lucy, good for you.
I'd like to have something that promotes player skill without the nasty side effects of spam, camping and massive team damage.
/OFF
Some of us have been known to come on to Satgnu! and whoop ass with high ping, including yours.
Get off of your cloud and play on some other servers before you call yourself l33t, sunshine. You're average at best.
/ON
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Well since they're doing something to tyrants in the next version, I'd like to see how that turns out before creating new weapons to counter them. I don't recall reading what they're doing to tyrants though.
We could always install little ledges onto the wall of every map and then we'd end up having both teams camping because they're afraid to attack the other.
So you want a crylink that doesn't suck. I'd rather have a mortar for fighting tyrants though.
I just can't picture a gun that shoots 5 balls that far apart with no spread, is it gonna be like, huge?
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@Lava
/OFF
Some of us have been known to come on to Satgnu! and whoop ass with high ping, including yours.
Get off of your cloud and play on some other servers before you call yourself l33t, sunshine. You're avarge at best.
/ON
+1
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@Lava
/OFF
Some of us have been known to come on to Satgnu! and whoop ass with high ping, including yours.
Get off of your cloud and play on some other servers before you call yourself l33t, sunshine. You're avarge at best.
/ON
+1
/OFF+2
/ON
I'd like to see a beam weapon in tremulous, since there atm is none.
Maybe this could work in the same lines as the weapon phreak mentioned, if you can imagine the beams spreading, but after some distance off the gun goes parallel.
The beams could have a duration similar to the maza zap and do slightly less damage than phreak's.
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Lol Tremma. The nooks are a good idea. I'm sure some people, lets not name names, would love it and use the "feature" to the max.
I'd love the mortar in Trem but the issue is spam and camping IMO.
The weapon and spred would not be huge but just big enough to be useful against bigger aliens while quite crappy towards smaller ones.
Size would be a tad bigger then Lucy with a chain style wide barrel.
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I'd like to see a beam weapon in tremulous, since there atm is none.
Maybe this could work in the same lines as the weapon phreak mentioned, if you can imagine the beams spreading, but after some distance off the gun goes parallel.
The beams could have a duration similar to the maza zap and do slightly less damage than phreak's.
Pulse laser is a beam. A real beam isn't constant stream of energy, its just appears that way. The pulse laser is about the closest thing to a beam that is possible with an online game.
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I'd like to see a beam weapon in tremulous, since there atm is none.
Maybe this could work in the same lines as the weapon phreak mentioned, if you can imagine the beams spreading, but after some distance off the gun goes parallel.
The beams could have a duration similar to the maza zap and do slightly less damage than phreak's.
Pulse laser is a beam. A real beam isn't constant stream of energy, its just appears that way. The pulse laser is about the closest thing to a beam that is possible with an online game.
Counter example :
- Quake 1 shaft
- Quake 3 shaft
- Unreal Tournament ( 99/2003/2004 ) pulse rifle secondary fire
PS : shaft is the lightning gun.
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Some of us have been known to come on to Satgnu! and whoop ass with high ping, including yours.
Get off of your cloud and play on some other servers before you call yourself l33t, sunshine. You're average at best.
Firstly, I cannot recall me writing I was 'l33t'.
Secondly, like everyone knows, I am not a fighter but a builder. Whooping my ass is not much harder than whooping your own ass, since my strength lies somewhere else.
Thirdly, I cannot recall having seen you on SatGNU once, and if you do frequent there, be so manly to give me your in-game nick. That way I can see if you truly are as 'l33t' as you think you are.
And last, stop making a fool out of yourself with posting these retarded suggestions, based on false assumptions.
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/OFF-4
Who's put up the new yellow Reply buttons? They're rather nice!
/ON
PHREAK: Notwithstanding any assumptions, true or false, you may have based your weapon on I for one like the idea of it enough to be curious about how it would actually feel in-game.
You haven't made yet clear (or I've read past that sentence) what stage you would like the weapon to become available at (I presume S3) or what it should be priced like (probably the Lucy?)
What about coding it as a mod - that way people could play with it and servers whose admins like it could use the mod. If the Trem devs would like it, they could incorporate it themselves. There, a way for us to test it, no harm done. If Lava disagrees with me, tell him I'll go builder next time we're on the same team, mwahahahahaha.
-- R.
(EDIT: Can someone pls tell me why the friggin' sig doesn't work?!)
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(EDIT: Can someone pls tell me why the friggin' sig doesn't work?!)
Did you disable BBCode in the post?
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If Lava disagrees with me, tell him I'll go builder next time we're on the same team, mwahahahahaha.
No fucking way you will ever touch a Ckit:D
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Rapha,
The weapon would obviously be available at S3 and you are correct about the price range.
As far as the format of release:
I haven't given it much thought but your mod idea is good since it allows more people to test and give feedback.
I guess I'm going for a mod then.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I greatly appreciate it.
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A weapon that spreads out, making it sometimes hard to kill small aliens, but perfect for larger ones: The Chaingun.
And usually only first-rate goons can handle a pair of shotguns.
Exactly, chainsuits work very well against the bigger aliens, we dont really need another weapon. You do make a good point though, luci is much more effective at taking out dretches then it is large aliens.
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(EDIT: Can someone pls tell me why the friggin' sig doesn't work?!)
Did you disable BBCode in the post?
Nope, I even tried changing my sig to HTML, which is also enabled... it says: Options
HTML is ON
BBCode is ON
Smilies are ON
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I guess I'm going for a mod then.
Looking forward to trying it out :-)
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If Lava disagrees with me, tell him I'll go builder next time we're on the same team, mwahahahahaha.
No fucking way you will ever touch a Ckit:D
Heheh, maybe we should change the AdvCKit a bit for you. My idea is a Supervanced Construction Kit that builds 5 turrets in a rather wide formation with no or very little spread :D
*searches a place to hide from both Lava and Phreak*
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Does Halo 2 count as online?
The sentinel beam is a beam weapon.
I only wish it was available for more than just Vista.
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Does Halo 2 count as online?
The sentinel beam is a beam weapon.
I only wish it was available for more than just Vista.
If it plays online, it counts for that. But such examples are rather useless since we have a game as old as Quake 1 as counter example ;) Beat that for a beam type weapon that worked across the crappy internet connections of the time.
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i'm always interested in new weapons. i'd like to see hwo this one turns out.
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I own goons with luci, tyrants somtimes.. i think lava is right about you. (that was damn hard to say) lol
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<OT>Uh, this is OT, but since the SatGNU-flame thread is closed and you're reading here Solo: (1) based on the discussion in that threat I'm not sure whether I would want you or Lava and maci as RL friends, although it has a tendency towards the latter BUT (2) there's a big exception to that (I'm sure I won't get a "maci approved" badge on that one, and I don't wanna) which is this: "WE from SatGNU" (counting myself into the "we" since I hang out in #satgnu and have generously been given admin rights) do NOT think German to be a superior language. That is to say, others from the SatGNU gang might think so, *I* do *not*. Actually, I think English is far superior to German, mostly because it is easier to learn as a foreign language. Just wanted to clarify on that because I felt a little misrepresented by Cynic|MIETZ's post. If there are any truly superior languages, that would be either one of Ancient Greek or Latin, not sure which. Wait. Ruby! Ruby clearly is the superiorst of all. Mwahahah.</OT>
So, PHREAK, got any concept drawings yet? :-)
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@rapha
I want to code it first and figure out the details before I go to modeling.
@Solo
Never have I claimed that a lucy can't kill a goon or a tyrant. But so can a shotgun (very effectivly) and a regular rifle.
I'm glad that you get to kill big stuff with the big guns but keep in mind the servers you play on.
If you ever have a chance to fight me, Zel, Orc or any other good tyrant players 1v1, you will NOT live to brag about it; regardles of the weapon you're holding.
Thanks for the feedback guys.
I'll start working on the mod very soon.
There are even a few people that wish to help with it.
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Stand on a ledge and shoot down at them.
Tyrants are like white men, they can't jump.
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Does Halo 2 count as online?
The sentinel beam is a beam weapon.
I only wish it was available for more than just Vista.
Halo sucks.
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Stand on a ledge and shoot down at them.
Tyrants are like white men, they can't jump.
lol3rsk8s :human:
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Stand on a ledge and shoot down at them.
Tyrants are like white men, they can't jump.
Not true! I'm a white guy and yesterday i jumped 4 inches!