Tremulous Forum
General => Feedback => Topic started by: player1 on April 19, 2007, 05:50:50 am
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Any thoughts as to adding a compass to the radar? If anyone remembers the Infiltration mod from Unreal, or the Tribes HUD, you'll know what I'm talking about. Just wondering if anyone else thinks it could be useful.
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The maps aren't all that complicated and after a few (hundred) games you pretty much have a schematic in your head anyway.
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I can kickass n00b team of humans even with blind fold as long as I know what map we are playing ^^
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Maybe instead a minimap with position of teammates on it?
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tomb raider anyone?
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tomb raider anyone?
Mmmm, she's hot.
I like the compass-radar idea. It gives mappers the opportunity to think about making bigger maps without fearing that countless noobs will get hopelessly lost somewhere out in the boonies.
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Who cares if newbs get lost out there somewhere its all the more fun to hunt them down
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Who cares if newbs get lost out there somewhere its all the more fun to hunt them down
Haha, well if they are truly noobs, they won't understand the compass and get lost anyway, I suppose...
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A compass seems would be very cool to have some kind of minimap, but that might not be feasible in Tremulous. It would be pretty hard to pull off on a lot of the maps that have multiple levels on top of each other (Niveus, Tremor with the sewers, to name two).
Integrating the radar into a compass might be cool though, at least for humans.
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You mean like:
/|N|\
W#E
\|S|/
compas or map of some short?
Map is something I don't like. Fun part of mapping is to add routes (vents etc.) that are hidden from newbie eye. 2d over view map would ruin my fun :P
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When he said compass, I was thinking like something across the bottom or top of the screen that scrolled around and always pointed in the direction you're facing.
Like this:
| | | | W | | | | N | | | | E | | | |
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When he said compass, I was thinking like something across the bottom or top of the screen that scrolled around and always pointed in the direction you're facing.
Like this:
| | | | W | | | | N | | | | E | | | |
That might kill your frame rate when you're playing a map that's not set on a planet.
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What do you mean kill your frame-rate?
Just align it to the map coordinates.
Don't pretend maps don't have coordinates, I've seen building layout files, and pictures of non-rotating Bounding Boxes.
How hard would it be to program, and how much would it hurt your FPS?
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I think he's referring to a space station or something of the like where your compass would constantly be spinning, and if it were to look graphically decent at all, constant, and fast, spinning would, indeed, kill framerates.
But, I do agree with techhead, in GTK Radiant the top can be considered North as a benchmark, just translate that into Tremulous and you have a compass that points towards wherever north was in the editor.
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why not just keep track of how many times you turned around? unfortunately tremulous doesn't allow more complicated physics and maps (with, for instance, realistic 0G or surfaces with "curved gravity") where your sense of direction could actually get completely messed up.
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i like the wining noobs whit there "im lost plz help me im at a gray wall "spams
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It took me a while to get Niveus memorized...I never used that stairwell much.
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What really helps in memorizing maps, is to get an empty server and some paper and then start sketching out a floorplan.
Thermal really messes with your sense of direction, to me hours to sketch that one out.
However, this probably wont help your average noob.
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Lol, say, go no0rth and noobs would press themselves up against the next northern object they find.
But seriously, unless someone make a map that takes days to explore, what is the point, please dont tell me you need a mappish compass.
And anyway, who the hell thinks north s E W in any map?
No.
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I dont think many of you have thought too hard about the physics involved. A compass requires a series of magnetic poles, without interference from large metal structures. 2/3 of the tremulous maps are on some spaceship/station/shit/etc, and 99% of the maps that arent involve huge metal structures. The only map a compass would work well for would be Ancient Remains.
The minimap under development by Timbo is a much better idea, because it behaves just like it is supposed to. Everything within the players line of site at the start is on the minimap. As the player explores the map, more things show up. If the player finds something, they can tag it. The vents would not show up for any joe to find, as they require you to see into them and know what they are, so that would not be a problem.
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blah, blah, blah. useless crap.
The minimap under development by Timbo is a much better idea, because it behaves just like it is supposed to. Everything within the players line of site at the start is on the minimap. As the player explores the map, more things show up. If the player finds something, they can tag it. The vents would not show up for any joe to find, as they require you to see into them and know what they are, so that would not be a problem.
=0 Minimap? Are you serious? Info on this in the secret board? Cool.
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id rather have that if u pres m ull see the 3d of the map and where u are atm and then u can move the 2d pic whit ur mouse to see it and where to go, would b sweet
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Scratch up another item to put on "List of 1.2.0 features I just can't wait for"
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id rather have that if u pres m ull see the 3d of the map and where u are atm and then u can move the 2d pic whit ur mouse to see it and where to go, would b sweet
m is medkit.
Oh, and, why would you go through all that trouble just to get dretched?
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hey blackadder, if you reach s4, you can buy a brain
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@Para: Yeah, but the game takes place in, like, 4025 A.D.! Current VR systems use other ways to keep track of your orientation. I know you like scopes and compasses and all, but I don't mean it has to be like the 3 right next to my desk (or the 47 with that big pile of optics you have), i.e., it wouldn't have to be the Boy Scout magnetic needle kind. It could be GPS, and a beacon in the helmet tells the satellite which way you're facing. It is supposed to be 2000 years in the future, right? Good point, though. Although lots of shooters have even less plausible minimaps and compasses.
@whitebear: I agree about the minimap. As you said, it would give too much away. As many posters here said, players should play the maps and learn the maps (the default maps at least). I've played "single player" versions of all the defaults as both factions, just to learn where things are (beating Human defenses as a dretch is hard to learn). The blind jump into the Human default base on Arachnid is sweet. It took me a long time to get familiar with that map. Players should have to earn it by playing more.
I would use a compass more to describe things in teamchat, than to find my way (unless the map was new and unfamiliar). I also think it could be toggled on or off, just like tutorial mode. If you need a quick position fix, toggle it on, and suffer the framerate drop. When you're done, toggle it off. I just think "west end of green hallway" is the way soldiers would describe their position. It makes sense, and it works with our current military technology, let alone two millennia hence.
Sketching the maps is a great idea. I only learn with a pencil anyway, 'cuz that's the way I was taught.
Thanks for the input, y'all. Just idly wondering if anyone else had ever played any games with compasses in them, or had thought one might be useful for describing rooms and spaces within maps ("We're not in that room. The NORTH red hallway!").
Edit: @Para: Oh, well, that minimap sounds cool. If you could also share the "tagged" waypoints with your team, that would be pretty useful (Tribes-style). "Reac move to X location in two minutes".
Cheers.
Re-edited for clarity a day later and a dollar shorter.
PB: The Timbo minimap that Para is talking about sounds cool. One that just shows everything, without the player having to find it first, would be too easy though. That's why I edited the first post.
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just dl a wallhack and youll be able to see everything important
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How would the minimap give anything away? You have to explore the map for it to show up.
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Make (important) friendly buildings show up on the mini-map and I'm good to go.
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Any thoughts as to adding a compass to the radar?
It's very easy and would fit well into the UI. Basically you place a squashed ring around the human radar and have it wobble around a bit.
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Guys, look here:
http://bugzilla.icculus.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3024
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Sweet, and by the way, I found about this research study.
People wore belts that vibrated in what ever direction was North. However, many people found that their sense of direction was greatly enhanced, beside a knowing which way was North. They never got lost, and could create highly detailed maps in their head of the area simply by walking around.
How it relates to Trem is, in FPS people often simply associate what places connect to where, which does little in knowing which door to take or which route is fastest. With a simple compass, they could relate which way they are going, and how they got there, with a single point of reference.
When I first started playing Halo, I easily got lost in multiplayer. I soon learned just to look for the nav point that marked the enemy flag. I then found my way around the levels much easier and soon knew the levels like the back of my hand.
Viola, research study, application, and anecdote.
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People wore belts that vibrated in what ever direction was North.
Anyone else notice anything, erm, strange, or, double-meaninged about this.
If you are 13 or over you'll know what im talking about. Minors, go read the bible.
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Here is the first page of an article about it.
http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/15.04/esp.html
Trust me, I'm not making this stuff up.
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Sweet, and by the way, I found about this research study.
People wore belts that vibrated in what ever direction was North. However, many people found that their sense of direction was greatly enhanced, beside a knowing which way was North. They never got lost, and could create highly detailed maps in their head of the area simply by walking around.
How it relates to Trem is, in FPS people often simply associate what places connect to where, which does little in knowing which door to take or which route is fastest. With a simple compass, they could relate which way they are going, and how they got there, with a single point of reference.
When I first started playing Halo, I easily got lost in multiplayer. I soon learned just to look for the nav point that marked the enemy flag. I then found my way around the levels much easier and soon knew the levels like the back of my hand.
Viola, research study, application, and anecdote.
techhead: exactly
when you have a waypoint or at least a North indication, it's much easier to memorize, navigate, extrapolate, and etc.
that's why the military uses such technology
it improves routefinding and teamwork
two things people always complain that n00bs know nothing about
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(http://www.tombraiders.net/stella/images/TR4/tr4_compass.gif)
tomb raider FTW
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(http://www.tombraiders.net/stella/images/TR4/tr4_compass.gif)
tomb raider FTW
img link not working
4me
was it funny?
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I think it would be even better if you where to have a compass tha tinstead of facing north, faced towards your Reactor or Over Mind, because we all have had that one evil person on our team deconstruct the Over Mind/Reactor and then move it into some random spot where no one knew. Plus sometimes you lose place of where the base is when your wallwalking as an alien, *is dizzy from to much of that*
That or have a special thing for aliens that says which way is up.