Tremulous Forum

General => General Discussion => Topic started by: DarkStorm on October 08, 2001, 01:28:00 am

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 08, 2001, 01:28:00 am

I'll be honest.  This isn't right.  Not this mod, not at this time.  I admit, I haven't made it to the chatroom in more than a month due to my job, which leaves me four hours of personal time on workdays, and weekends to conduct personal business.  But every weekend I've been setting aside more and more time to do what I said I would do, map.  And my original map is coming along.  While I think it sucks, it's still something to work with.  I still believe it will be the first complete map for tremulous, and I still believe that it will be near-production quality.

I trusted things would move forward without my presence.  Timbo knows that for a good couple of months I was in the chat on an almost daily basis, trying to get people motivated, trying to produce what I could to prove that people were getting some work done.  But no matter what I did, things didn't quite get started.  And with my new job coming up, I figured it was a good time to give it a rest, and just like Timbo I took a month off because for a time I was spending 12 hours at work every day.

Currently, there are two rooms left to complete in my map (working name "Rape").  One of which is half done, and should be quite accompanying as a droid(or whatever they're called now) spawn.  I'm also trying to decide between a 100$/month DSL connection with gauranteed bandwidth, or a $35/month cable connection with a greater 2meg/sec burst rate, but less impressive average rate.  I seem just a little too late though.  I hate it when I fall out of the loop, this shit always happens when I just trust things to work themselves out while I go to my own little corner and do what I'm supposed to.

I'm mildy angered.  I'm not sure what I want to do with my work thus far.  I feel it unjust that I'm suddenly flicked from a team that I had been quite devoted to for more than half a year now...  I'm still going to work on my map for the time being... probably feel out what appears to be a completely new mod to me...  See peoples responses to a handful of new screenshots...

I'll probably talk to the other former members of the tremulous team too.

I'm not saying if I'm staying or going just yet...  But I am NOT happy...  I mean damn, here's all this stuff I've produced for the website, for sprite graphics, for shaders, and most importantly for maps, and I've just been removed as though I never existed, as though you never really needed me.  And you two couldn't even spare the time to drop me an e-mail to ask if I was still working...

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Veda on October 08, 2001, 02:35:00 am

From Timbo's post :

"In May, I effectively took a month out from Tremulous due to exam pressure. I was hoping that when I returned with people on vacation things would pick up. Unfortunately they didn't. By August I was at my wits end and ready to stop Tremulous altogether to work on other projects. Having something you've spent months of spare time working on appear to be redundant is hard to swallow."

It was either this or no Tremulous. DarkStorm I understand you did alot of work. But understand in 11 months not 1 model was put into the game. For those 11 months Timbo worked on this mod almost everyday with the except of May.

I had been working on my mod since January. Timbo was going to drop Tremulous. I said maybe we can work something out because I had alot of content already. In 2 months - just 2 months, we got over 20 finished(skinned/animated) models in the game. I bring to Tremulous over 100 textures, 2 sky maps, a level, 4 gun models, mapobjects, and a frontend. At this point I've written around 30-40 shaders. I'm not even counting models that haven't been exported yet.

6 months ago you posted some of Pyslo's weapons to be created into models and put into the game.

http://tremulous.sourceforge.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=40&forum=1

6 months. I'm sorry, but thats not fair to do to Timbo. Not 1 model was put into the game. Not 1. DarkStorm I know you don't model but I can put a weapon model into the game in 1 week and I am not that fast and I am not bragging.

Timbo told me he was frustrated, people would vanish for weeks and come back. No one set schedules. Timbo did his best to pressure. But what can he say?

"probably feel out what appears to be a completely new mod to me"

There never was a Tremulous before DarkStorm. It had NO identity. Sure there was some code but thats it. There wasn't even a finished plan. Timbo did his part, he did what he could.

In short DarkStorm, I hope you continue on your map. I hope you realize Tremulous was not going to be completed. Timbo was going to bag it because he wasn't getting enough support. He can't do it all. Mods take 3 things : dedication, dedication, dedication. It wasn't happening.

Of course if you want to talk email me or on IRC. Forget to put my email here : mike@cybercowboys.com

[ This Message was edited by: Veda on 2001-10-07 22:07 ]

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Timbo on October 08, 2001, 02:44:00 am

Quote

On 2001-10-07 17:28, DarkStorm wrote:
And with my new job coming up, I figured it was a good time to give it a rest, and just like Timbo I took a month off because for a time I was spending 12 hours at work every day.

One thing I want to point out here, is that in my month off, I was on irc daily and in communication with anybody that happenned to be there. I wasn't working (on Tremulous), but I still existed to those that used the irc channel. I don't think its fair to compare a month without work and a month without communication.

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Carcinogen on October 08, 2001, 07:31:00 am

[edit]...deleted my rant. no need for it anymore.[/edit]

[ This Message was edited by: Carcinogen on 2001-10-16 15:59 ]

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Mighty Pea on October 08, 2001, 03:36:00 pm

well, here it is, they chucked someone else out...
i too was booted, because i didn't do anything... and i was a skinner, if anyone could've pointed me to a model to skin they where divine, because there where none.
after this, Timbo acted rather unpleasant to me, i even belive he ignored me in icq (im msg'd him, and he wasn't away, and he never replied)
i was (and still am) greatly saddened by this, i was willing to be 100% into tremulous, but timbo decided to take in someone else, the thing that saddens me most though, is that i haven't seen one skin of this new guy yet, while timbo promised to show me some.
i honestly love this mod, and can fully understand how it feels, being booted from it.
i still told everyone what a great mod this is, but i'm getting more and more agitated as i see people being treated wrong (it's true, the mod is really moving now, but in my case, after my kicking, nothing progressed anymore then it did before)
well, enough ranting, it suffices to say i'm saddened.
*m

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 08, 2001, 05:45:00 pm

"Timbo worked on this mod almost everyday with the except of May."

"I'm sorry, but thats not fair to do to Timbo."

"...people would vanish for weeks and come back."

"Timbo did his best..."

"There never was a Tremulous..."

"...NO identity."

"It wasn't happening."

"I don't think its fair..."

And through it all I worked.  But in the end I am nothing.

As though I never understood how much this hurt Timbo.  As though it never hurt me or anyone else.  You can condescend me as though it's not my project anymore, because it's not.  But you can't condescend me as though it never was, because it was.  It was my project, our project.  And we were dedicated to it, even if we weren't in a chatroom to tell you so.

In salvaging your dream, you crushed others.  And before you reply again telling me how "wrong" I am, why don't you just save it until I've had a little time to adjust to this entire event.

[ This Message was edited by: DarkStorm on 2001-10-08 09:46 ]

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Psylo on October 08, 2001, 07:54:00 pm

I don't care if I am in "the team" or not..
If someone can do the job better,then he shall go ahead and do it!
If it is better for the mod...why not.
But I think work would be more efficient in a well coordinated team.
What I was missing all the time, is that I did not really have that feeling of belonging together as a team.
When Darkstorm made those blueprints of my weapon sketches and Carc said he was going to make the models that was REALLY cool.

But we  all should have done more together, to actually FEEL like a team.
I dont need to be in some thing called team just for the fame of beeing an official developer of a cool mod.

I dont even care if Im in the credits.


I do  not doubt that everyone worked on his tasks, the problem (for me) was, that i did not see, what the others were doing.

If we meet regulary, and I mean ALL at the same time, work and communicate like a team,
then we will be a team..no matter if we are in a list or not..dont forget that.

Oh and one last thing, Timbo, you called yourself Mod-coordinator i think. Kicking the whole team in that position is like giving up.
Maybe all we needed was better coordination.
And now, with open development it needs a good coordinator more than ever.

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 08, 2001, 08:30:00 pm

My point, Psylo, is quite simply this:

I don't neccesarily disagree with the direction the mod has taken.  Progress is good.  What I disagree with, is the manner in which the team was dissolved; in an uncaring, spiteful, "Fuck You" manner.

Observe:

(Imaginary Letter From Timbo to Team Members)

Dear [Person],
     Due to the current circumstances under which work is proceeding at an unsatisfactory rate I am thinking about taking the mod in a new direction.  I've been talking to Veda for the past two months.  He has a great amount of media that would instantly up the progress on Tremulous if we were to merge our mods.  This change would render many of the files we have created thus far as unusable, but most of the files lost would be replaced by media that has already been produced by Veda.  This would be a great jump-start to the mod and I strongly encourage you to consider, and prepare for this event.

     Secondly, due to problems with certain members of the team proclaiming their dedication and then not doing any work, I feel it might be benefecial to move the mod into an open-development status in the way of other open-source software, such as mozilla.  This would mean that essentially there would no longer be a team.  As such, there wouldn't be anymore 'administrators' on the forum or the tremulous channel.  However we would still work together in much the same way as we did before, except people would no longer have to "Report in" to let us know they're alive.  They would only need to drop their files off when they were done and celebrate.  Please get back to me as soon as possible on this, your response will be appreciated.

Notice that I just stated all the events that have happened up til now in an imaginary letter, written in a polite (perhaps too polite) manner.  Now I can honestly say that if I had recieved such a letter, I would have agreed to the whole thing, and he wouldn't have a pissed off little mapper with so much now-useless media on his hard drive being quasi-bitchy on his forum.

I'm not bitching about the mod, I'm bitching about the treatment I, you, and everyone else recieved and I think that, for some of us at least, it was ill-deserved.

[ This Message was edited by: DarkStorm on 2001-10-09 11:06 ]

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Carcinogen on October 08, 2001, 09:13:00 pm

[edit]...[/edit]

[ This Message was edited by: Carcinogen on 2001-10-16 15:59 ]

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Psylo on October 09, 2001, 04:03:00 pm

rape016?

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 09, 2001, 07:00:00 pm

The map I was working on at precisely the same time Timbo decided he was the only one doing any work...

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Psylo on October 09, 2001, 09:55:00 pm

hmm, show me some screenshots when the light is done please
can someone tell me, why there is still a "tremulous dev." under my name..there isnt even any work here for me now...

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: HOB on October 10, 2001, 09:07:00 pm

bwahahahhahahah...HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
what a bunch of babies, now you see why it's a bitch to work on a team with people(tweens) like darkstorm.


* HOB holds his hand up to his ear and says,"What was that?". HOB watches as the people reply,"UT is superior".
_________________
King of the Jungle

[ This Message was edited by: HOB on 2001-10-10 13:17 ]

[ This Message was edited by: HOB on 2001-10-10 15:01 ]

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 10, 2001, 10:41:00 pm

I'm beginning to agree with you (on the people part UT is still inferior).

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: HOB on October 10, 2001, 10:56:00 pm

since my post is 12 and yours is unlucky 13 mine is obviously correct in that UT is superior

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 11, 2001, 12:03:00 am

Now what did I tell you about trying to count without your hands and toes?  My post is 14 HOB.  Which is seven multiplied by two.  Meaning not only are you unlucky, but I'm double lucky.  Quake III continues to reign over UT.

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: HOB on October 11, 2001, 12:18:00 am

too bad it says how many replies are on the thread, you lose and are unlucky

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: DarkStorm on October 11, 2001, 03:31:00 pm

Are you really so lazy that you cannot count the posts.  Really HOB if you're going to state a fact, assure your fact is correct.

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: HOB on October 11, 2001, 06:56:00 pm

I'm lazy because I'm fat, at least I have an excuse

Title: I don't like this.
Post by: Stannum on October 11, 2001, 07:09:00 pm

Thats no excuse