Feedback On 1.2 Admins

[Silver]

All I'm saying is if they can't spend enough time on a server to at least obtain adminship, let alone prove they are good at admin, than they probably shouldn't be an admin on that server. It seems pretty straightforward to me.

They obtain it by one of us thinking they're responsible enough to handle it, and then us giving it to them. I don't know why you think time should have anything to do with it. It's not an RPG where you have to grind on one instance in order to level up.

Dealing with teamkillers, griefers, and assholes is a chore. If a person wants to do it -- instead of having others handle it so they can actually play the game -- then they're probably not suited for the job.

Woah woah woah.. that is very backwards thinking.  While adminning is a chore, you want people who are not going to ignore their duties simply because they want to keep playing.  At AA I've stopped my own entertainment of the game dozens of times to spec a potential botter or to check and see if someone is intentionally tking etc etc.  An admin has to be very capable of following whats going on all around them including both teams and keeping an eye out for greifers/deconners and the likes.  Now someone who wants admin generally doesn't make a good admin, but a person who wants an admin's responsibilities is a whole different story.  Wanting to keep the server playable for yourself and others is a good thing.

Treating admin so lax is not a good idea.  "I think A is trustable cause he's been my friend for a while or he's in MG so what the hell."

Where as the correct scenario is "I think B would make a good admin because he's on often, competent, fast to react to deconners and the likes with kick votes, knows the scenario fully before making any decisive action, and is generally level headed."

[Bissig]

Holy-shit-once-in-a-trem-time-experience:

I totally agree with Silver. ;-)

[Lava_Croft]

Just tell me I have to ban 10 people per month to remain administrator and I will do so.

[janev]

There are two different schools of thought:
- Give adminlevels to all the good folks, with higher levels for the goodest folks
- Try to get more control by having a few very active admins

I have to agree with norf and lava and go for the first option. The more people you have keeping an eye out the better. The system becomes self-regulatory. Rather than trying to individually block all the retards it's more efficient to control the admins. With half the server regulars having level three you will eliminate most of that

stopped my own entertainment of the game dozens of times to spec a potential botter or to check and see if someone is intentionally tking etc etc.

Giving someone the ability to remove destructive players also gives them a strong incentive to play on that server.

[Liskey]

Which is what has been happening.

Many of the active players are level 3s, there are usually several admins on anytime the server is populated, and griefing is generally dealt with pretty well.  But more important, having several admins online builds consensus and consistency - seeing how a senior admin handles things provides examples for the juniors.  (Not to mention the supervision effect - any junior admin tempted to abuse will think twice when he knows others are watching.)

[Silver]

There are two different schools of thought:
- Give adminlevels to all the good folks, with higher levels for the goodest folks
- Try to get more control by having a few very active admins

I have to agree with norf and lava and go for the first option. The more people you have keeping an eye out the better. The system becomes self-regulatory. Rather than trying to individually block all the retards it's more efficient to control the admins. With half the server regulars having level three you will eliminate most of that

stopped my own entertainment of the game dozens of times to spec a potential botter or to check and see if someone is intentionally tking etc etc.

Giving someone the ability to remove destructive players also gives them a strong incentive to play on that server.

I'm not saying you shouldn't have a healthy amount of active admins.  AA has over 50 admins.  I'm just saying you can't just give admin to regulars because they're your friends.  More so they have to be people you trust to do the job(not just people you generally like)

[_Equilibrium_]

I'm not saying you shouldn't have a healthy amount of active admins.  AA has over 50 admins.  I'm just saying you can't just give admin to regulars because they're your friends.  More so they have to be people you trust to do the job(not just people you generally like)

The problem with this point is that you generally trust your friends or people you like, otherwise they wouldn't be your friend or a person you like.

[Asvarox]

I think he meant that it's not bad to give admin level to a friend until you know he will do his job. I mean you certainly have a friend that you like, but you know he wont be good admin because he's really "emotional" and easily gets pissed off.

I believe that if a friend comes to you and ask to use your power because "I'm your friend dud" you shouldn't do that unless there's a good reason to do so (separate "business" from private life). If he gets mad and tell you that he hates you, then he's not a friend.

[Lava_Croft]

Please do not mention shitholes like AA when trying to get a point across.

[janev]

snip

I'm not saying you shouldn't have a healthy amount of active admins.  AA has over 50 admins.  I'm just saying you can't just give admin to regulars because they're your friends.  More so they have to be people you trust to do the job(not just people you generally like)

Why not?
-!setlevel is not permanent
-Abuse will happen but you will have a much more robust system to deal with all levels of abuse.
-By being a control-freak you severely increase your own stress levels

You give out low admin levels generously and see who makes the cut. Promote the ones who do a good job and restrict the highest level of administration to the top tier of trustees.  It needs to be noted that what some whiney bitches see as abusive is just a no-bullshit-policy. If someone is out of order with the server policy you bump them down it's as simple as that.

[Silver]

snip

I'm not saying you shouldn't have a healthy amount of active admins.  AA has over 50 admins.  I'm just saying you can't just give admin to regulars because they're your friends.  More so they have to be people you trust to do the job(not just people you generally like)

Why not?
-!setlevel is not permanent
-Abuse will happen but you will have a much more robust system to deal with all levels of abuse.
-By being a control-freak you severely increase your own stress levels

You give out low admin levels generously and see who makes the cut. Promote the ones who do a good job and restrict the highest level of administration to the top tier of trustees.  It needs to be noted that what some whiney bitches see as abusive is just a no-bullshit-policy. If someone is out of order with the server policy you bump them down it's as simple as that.

Starting out with low levels makes sense in some aspect, but trust me that can be more hassle than it's worth.  You know how many complaints I get about a putteam or a mute daily?  The devs shouldn't do that if they aren't willing to deal with the hassle(which they aren't).

@ Lavacroft, AA has changed a lot over the past few months.  The admin list has been cleaned up big time and people aren't allowed to do whatever the fuck they want.  Your opinion on the server is yours to keep but I think it's rather un-educated.  The only issue I could see you having is that it runs ATCS almost solely.  The server regulars enjoy the map, it's balanced, and it really helps with the people who don't know how to turn auto_download on in 1.1.  If your sole issue is the maps it runs, that's kind of sad.  But it's your opinion and you're free to have it.  Enjoy playing in shithol.. I mean satgnu!(you should delete your account again you weren't missed)

Equil, I have a lot of friends I don't trust with admin and vice versa.  I know Ozzy was always hesitant to give me admin when he ran AA and for good reason.  I realize emotional and temper mental.  That's why I picked a lot of high level admins that I trust more than myself - flux, tbob, einstein, paradinas, and celestial rage to do the job of monitoring lower admins and most of the server moderating for me.



I agree that having a lot of low level admins is a good thing and progressively promoting or demoting based on performance is also good as well.  That you can't truly know how everyone will perform and so you just have to take chances.  I just think activity, trust, and common sense are far more important features to consider for an admin than general likability and your taste of their personality.

[janev]

I've said all I wanted to say on the 1.2 admin system but lava was definitely missed <3.

Moar drama pleaaase!

[Lava_Croft]

@Silver: Trying to explain real democracy to a Chinese Burmese person by using Somalia as an example is stupid. Also, SatGNU-Tremulous is dead, long live MEGAPROCYON! Get with the times!

[amz181]

@Silver: Trying to explain real democracy to a Chinese Burmese person by using Somalia as an example is stupid. Also, SatGNU-Tremulous is dead, long live MEGAPROCYON! Get with the times!

who is this kid?

[StevenM]

So i've heard that it was actually TJW's kid deconning lol.

My apologies TJW, should've figured that one out. sorry.

[_Equilibrium_]

does tjw have 2 kids? ethan and john? ethan loves to bleed.