Author Topic: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons  (Read 61819 times)

Nux

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #60 on: November 25, 2008, 06:10:30 pm »
Name 1 gas that in earths atmosphere forms a spherical shape...

How about air in a balloon? Or sparks from a sparkler? Or a little flame? Or these little plasma balls?

A gas can take many shapes. A sphere is one of the shapes it can take. It's visible shape is something seperate from it's actual distribution. In the case of a firey ball you're only seeing the light emmiting portion which can very naturally be focused at one point and the aura can account for the overall ball-shape.

nubcake

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #61 on: November 25, 2008, 06:24:25 pm »
This isn't earth, now, is it? ;D

Then how do marines breathe and gravity affect them the same way ;)

Name 1 gas that in earths atmosphere forms a spherical shape...

How about air in a balloon? Or sparks from a sparkler? Or a little flame? Or these little plasma balls?

A gas can take many shapes. A sphere is one of the shapes it can take. It's visible shape is something seperate from it's actual distribution. In the case of a firey ball you're only seeing the light emmiting portion which can very naturally be focused at one point and the aura can account for the overall ball-shape.

Flames arent spherical, they are elongated because the burning gas weighs less than the surrounding air. Airballoons are round because the object material is shaped to be round. Balloons are round due to the same reason, and gas spreads out in (relatively) equal direction in free space (vacuum). The plasma 'balls' were created very momentarily and require constant heat (by laser) to be formed. Also, with all of those theories, the luci ball should keep expanding, not maintain its constant shape :) Yes gas can *temporarily* create a sphere, but it will always expand or shrink in an atmosphere. Remember gas is formed by heat, therefore the theory of thermodynamics state that heat must be in a constant state of motion, and seeing as gas is one of the last forms of mass before turning into pure energy, there is alot of expansion and movement. Not just a constant shaped ball flying through the air :)
« Last Edit: November 25, 2008, 06:29:31 pm by nubcake »

Nux

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #62 on: November 25, 2008, 06:42:02 pm »
Flames arent spherical, they are elongated because they weigh less than the surrounding air.

This is why I said 'a little flame'.

When a flame is small enough, there is insufficient heat generated to create a strong convection current which would cause the elongation.

Airballoons are round because the object material is shaped to be round. Balloons are round due to the same reason, and gas spreads out in (relatively) equal direction in free space (vacuum).

Perhaps bubbles would be a better example. This example was meant to make it clear that the gases distribution is dependant upon external forces. Note the other extreme: If gas is released into outer space from a sufficiently small hole it will travel outward in a spherical shape.

The plasma 'balls' were created very momentarily and require constant heat (by laser) to be formed. Also, with all of those theories, the luci ball should keep expanding, not maintain its constant shape :)

The gas does keep expanding:

"The notable problem here is the extreme rate the plasma would dissipate and so it would require some stable feed of energy to maintain an excited state within the specific region." "It's visible shape is something separate from it's actual distribution. In the case of a firey ball you're only seeing the light emmiting portion"

The visible part (the glowing ball fired from the cannon) is all that concerns us. The lucifer ball could be like a sparkler and the ball shape is due to many little 'sparks' shooting out in a ball shape. Otherwise the shape could be the glare from the bright burning part in the middle. Either way, a sphere is a very natural shape for it to assume. It simply requires the pressures/emissions to be equal in all directions.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2008, 06:51:14 pm by Nux »

gimhael

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #63 on: November 25, 2008, 06:45:19 pm »
If it wasn't yellow I'd say it is a little white hole, but maybe there will be yellow holes too in the future.  :laugh:

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #64 on: November 25, 2008, 07:02:33 pm »
This isn't earth, now, is it? ;D

Then how do marines breathe and gravity affect them the same way ;)


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nubcake

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #65 on: November 26, 2008, 04:41:24 am »
[

The gas does keep expanding:

"The notable problem here is the extreme rate the plasma would dissipate and so it would require some stable feed of energy to maintain an excited state within the specific region." "It's visible shape is something separate from it's actual distribution. In the case of a firey ball you're only seeing the light emmiting portion"

The visible part (the glowing ball fired from the cannon) is all that concerns us. The lucifer ball could be like a sparkler and the ball shape is due to many little 'sparks' shooting out in a ball shape. Otherwise the shape could be the glare from the bright burning part in the middle. Either way, a sphere is a very natural shape for it to assume. It simply requires the pressures/emissions to be equal in all directions.

I just find it unrealistic for any type of gas to maintain constant shap after flying through the air. If anything, a pulse rifle would be more like a plasma stream

Nux

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #66 on: November 26, 2008, 10:26:42 am »
I'll say this one last time. In my example, the gas ISN'T maintaining a constant shape. You're only seeing the energetic material.

Imagine a fuse burning in the dark. You can't see the fuse where it isn't burning. The ash and the unburnt fuse is still there (and very much non-spherical) but it's not giving out light, so all you can see is the sparky point.

If this explanation isn't good enough, how about we say that the chainreaction is occurring on the string-level and it is actually distorting spacetime through the conversion of baryonic particles to exotic matter. The photons produced are merely a byproduct of the conversion (which accounts for the majority of the energy output and the actual destructive nature is due to this distortion of spacetime. The velocity is given to the projectile via partial dislocation of the ergosphere generated by the exotic conversion. This is achieved by using a multitude of positron-guns which are synergetically associated with a strong eigenfield with a conformal bias toward the vector norm of the exotic mapping.

nubcake

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #67 on: November 26, 2008, 11:09:15 am »
Ok, i could be a pessimist  and say String theory states that matter moves in ransom motion and distortion of space cannot occur on such a minute level to produce light, it would absorb it :D

To be perfectly honest, there is no realistic or scientifically feasible explantation for a luci cannon. All explanations so far would potentially destroy the planet in a single shot.

P.s about the burning fuse, i never said you could see the gas or that the gas was causing the sperical shape, i was stating that there is no gas that could create and maintain the appearance, whether the visual by products or material that would keep a spherical shape for the journey  through open air. In other words, there is no visual appearance on this world you will ever see like a luci ball that doesnt have a constant energy stream applied to it from an external force.

I think a better one could be, a luci cannon launches a small magnetic probe which flys along the air at constant motion. The magnetic probe polarises at different points drawing iron and other metals from the air to be drawn in and spin at a furious rate, heating the surrounding air and causing the white/yellow light. The damage caused is by super heated mettalic shrapnel

Nux

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #68 on: November 26, 2008, 01:43:32 pm »
Ok, i could be a pessimist  and say String theory states that matter moves in ransom motion and distortion of space cannot occur on such a minute level to produce light, it would absorb it :D

That's not pessimistic. It's unverifiable. I intentionally alluded to a situation which is far too complex to be able to study with the severe lack of empirical evidence we're likely to have in the near or far future.

To be perfectly honest, there is no realistic or scientifically feasible explanation for a luci cannon. All explanations so far would potentially destroy the planet in a single shot.

Now THAT'S pessimistic.

P.s about the burning fuse, i never said you could see the gas or that the gas was causing the sperical shape, i was stating that there is no gas that could create and maintain the appearance, whether the visual by products or material that would keep a spherical shape for the journey  through open air. In other words, there is no visual appearance on this world you will ever see like a luci ball that doesnt have a constant energy stream applied to it from an external force.

So why not an internal energy source like in the examples I gave?

Also, bear in mind that strangely Symmetric/complex shape of a mushroom cloud might have just as easily been dismissed if the energies/mechanisms involved weren't known.

I think a better one could be, a luci cannon launches a small magnetic probe which flys along the air at constant motion. The magnetic probe polarises at different points drawing iron and other metals from the air to be drawn in and spin at a furious rate, heating the surrounding air and causing the white/yellow light. The damage caused is by super heated mettalic shrapnel

This, like many of my earlier explanations, uses the idea that there is a denser 'core' to the projectile. No matter the specific mechanism, I think we can agree that this projectile needs a core and it needs to be travelling fast.

player1

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Re: Try of a realistic explanation of L.U.C.I.F.E.R.
« Reply #69 on: November 26, 2008, 08:19:18 pm »
with lasers!

w/ caveat

where LASER stands for Levitric-Apergic Amplification by the Stimulated Emission of Radiation*

*at least according the IG17's Interzaibatsu Concordance Report on Omniversal Picodestruction, after the damning evidence presented by Lord Brightness during the Council's Proceedings on the Rhubarb Ridge Incident, see Eno Reyalp, A History of Brindus and other Hellholes of Outer South Nowhere OR Tales of the Bug Wars: A Note for the Tremulous, tightcast from SVQ Trinity Station, weekends on the graveyard shift, aimed at willing recipients, New South Haldonia; cf. Anfidgean, Flovat, et al, Levity, Apergy, and a Great Big Ball of Plasma: A Discussion of Natx Shift and the Dernon Paradox, HR Research Publications, 4023 ICE, NSH FZ BIIIb

ohnoestroll

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #70 on: November 27, 2008, 12:20:31 am »
Why does everyone use the phrase "depleted uranium"?
Probably because it is far more radioactive than fresh uranium.
because its easy to pronounce, and it kills you faster

Syntac

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #71 on: November 27, 2008, 01:09:16 am »
A powerful electromagnetic field would be able to hold the Lucifer ball in check (assuming it's made of plasma; think Tokamak). I'm no physicist, but could a blob of superheated matter generate its own?

Samurai.mac

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #72 on: January 04, 2009, 08:09:29 pm »
What's to say it's not just simple combustion? A small amount of light weight, fairly slow-burning fuel is ignighted and projected into the air, if it shares a similar density to the atmosphere the effects of gravity on it in relation to the air will be minimal, allowing it to stay aloft for long periods of time. The fuel burns only where it can come into contact with oxygen, so from the outside inwards, giving it a long burn-time while traveling, but when it impacts a target it spreads out, increasing the surface area for oxygen to reach it. If the fuel was in two stages; a highly energetic fuel on the inside, surrounded by a less energetic "fuse" material, that would explain the sudden, explosive release of energy on impact.

As for it being an "energy weapon" if the amount of fuel it small, it could have a single high density ammunition supply contained inside, but requires an electric current to separate individual particles to carry them into the barrel of the weapon. The longer the electric current is applied for, the more molecules are able to break off from the supply.

I'm using some pretty hefty chunks of pseudo-science in that, but hey, we're fighting half-insect half-dinosaur 8 foot tall aliens for crying out loud!

player1

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Re: Try of a realistic explanation of Tremulous' human's foes
« Reply #73 on: January 05, 2009, 05:19:09 am »
half-insect half-dinosaur

Arthrosaurs (jointed reptiles)?

They can't be Arachnosaurs, 'cuz they're six-legged.

The_Spy

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #74 on: January 06, 2009, 02:29:22 am »
My explanation:
Blaster: Firing small pulses of molecular energy, the blaster does minimal damage. The design is based off the old technology "Pistol" Always carried by marines as a backup weapon, the Blaster's ammo regenerates giving it unlimited ammunition.

Rifle: A standard projectile weapon, this is a good choice for killing small aliens, Dretch mostly. It has a rapid firing rate, but this means that the ammunition is used up fast, and it takes a long time to reload.

Pain Saw: An interesting piece of technology, this weapon got its name from Soldiers in the field, noticing its adept power for destroying Alien structures, and doing massive damage to anything, from Granger to Tyrant. Some Marines even specialize in that one weapon alone. Using a combined melee attack with a jumping electrical arc, when activated the blades spin like a classic saw, but the blades are charged with electricity. These two combined powers make it a formidable weapon.

Shotgun: Classic weapon. Firing heavy Rantshot©, this gun carries 8 shells at a time, and is VERY effective at close quarters. Unfortunately, it is not good at long range, so its capabilities are limited.

Lasgun: The first high-power weapon at close and long range, the Lasgun fires Photon bursts at a rapid pace. Doing moderate damage, this gun can be upgraded with the Battery Pack to increase its ammo to 300 rather than 200.

Mass Driver: An almost completely sniper-oreinted weapon. Effective at long range and close, the mass driver is almost imposable to use at close range because of its unwieldiness. Despite these drawbacks, the advantages of this weapon are considerable. It fires on a completely straight course, firing high speed antimatter particles that do massive damage. It is also compatible with the Battery Pack, and is commonly used with the Jetpack.

Chaingun: A very good weapon for taking down larger aliens, this gun is effective at close and medium range. It works on the same solid-projectile principle of the rifle, but it contains 300 bullets in a large container. The drawback is that the weapon is very heavy, and will jerk around spasmodically because of the heavy firepower. Fortunately, when equipped with a Battlesuit, the kick is reduced to almost nil, and it is a common combo choice.

Pulse Rifle: Another clip weapon, this gun is completely different than the other guns so far. Another energy weapon, this gun fires concentrated Electron Plasma in very rapid bursts. A very powerful weapon, it is also compatible with the Battery Pack and is also a common Jetpack combo choice.

Grenade: A small explosive with a short timer.

Flamethrower: Known as the "Flamer" to most marines, it is a very good weapon for taking down small to medium alien classes. It uses a highly flamable liquid napalm formula ignited by a propane torch at the end of the emitter. If the wielder is careless, he may end up toasting himself.

Lucifer Cannon: It got its name for the Hell it gives the aliens. Using a Nuclear Reactor technology at the back of the gun, it fires concentrated blasts of radiation that travel slowly, but do INCREDIBLE damage at ANY range. Another interesting feature is the charge ability it has. it can charge for about 3 seconds, and that's enough to kill a Tyrant if it makes a direct hit. It also has an interesting fallout effect in the way that if it misses its target, it will still damage it to a certain extent. This is good for killing large clusters of structures. The drawback is that is it misses and hits near a friendly or structure, it will most likely kill or hurt it. It is also compatible with the Battery Pack.

This is my definition of the Trem Weapons.
And I did NOT use the phrase "Depleated Uranium"
There is no spoon. Or no continent called Europe. No spoon or Europe. Okay, that makes sense.

Archangel

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #75 on: January 06, 2009, 02:39:21 am »
luci does 295 damage max, rant has 400 hp fully healed. therefore, it can't kill it in one shot.  :helmet: :tyrant:


Kaleo

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #77 on: January 08, 2009, 03:54:22 am »
I have an idea! You won't be able to argue this.

The Lucifer cannon runs on Magic.
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player1

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Re: Start of a majickal explanation of Tremulous' omniverse
« Reply #78 on: January 08, 2009, 06:37:12 am »
I have an idea! You won't be able to argue this.

The Lucifer cannon runs on Magic.

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...or strange, controversial and quasi-magickal devices like the Lucifer Cannon, said to steal the souls of its victims to power its inexplicable metaphysical functionings, rumored to possibly harness apergic or levitric forces.

Kaleo

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #79 on: January 08, 2009, 11:08:03 am »
Nah nah nah...

I mean, like, full blown magic. World Of Warcraft style (yeah you'll hate me for that, won't you).

Shoots balls of flaming hot mana. They can keep it in glass bottles, can't they?
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Hendrich

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #80 on: January 13, 2009, 12:19:33 am »
Lucifier running on magic? Nahhh....

Most likely through divine power. Let the power of Christ spam you.  :angel:

zybork

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #81 on: January 13, 2009, 04:54:28 am »
Spy: The idea of this thread was to try to explain HOW they work, not WHAT they do.
I have retired from Tremulous. Definetely. If you play a game just because it has become a habit, but u'r only feeling like a kindergarten teacher - well, maybe I am just getting too old (hell, I was a teenager when DukeNukem3D was *new*) - it's probably not a bad idea to just let it be. And I do.

Don't take this personally. Have fun, guys.

The_Spy

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #82 on: January 20, 2009, 12:50:41 am »
Okay, I'll come up with one soon.
And you are correct, the fully charged luci does do 295 DMG. My bad.
There is no spoon. Or no continent called Europe. No spoon or Europe. Okay, that makes sense.

UniqPhoeniX

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #83 on: January 20, 2009, 01:05:07 am »
265, actually.

Doom [BnK]

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #84 on: March 05, 2009, 08:40:13 pm »
I always thought Lucidi would be light related, as it directly translates into "Light" in latin.

Kaleo

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #85 on: March 05, 2009, 09:08:52 pm »
I always thought Lucidi would be light related, as it directly translates into "Light" in latin.

Not really, since it's "Lucifer" and not "Lucidi" as you spelt it.

So, yeah. Lucifer. It's Satan see?

The Luci is probably powered by Black Metal.
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but you can blow it into chunky kibbles!
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Nux

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #86 on: April 01, 2009, 09:32:00 pm »
Well the words are in fact related as 'Lucifer' is actually latin for 'Light-Bringer'.

Makes sense, donut.

Jedarus

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #87 on: April 14, 2009, 06:01:36 pm »
The Luci is probably powered by crap.

I strongly disagree. It is powered by deathcore :P
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Winnie the Pooh

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #88 on: April 14, 2009, 11:57:41 pm »
                                                              Lucifer Cannon:

1)    The helium is spun around a central point in the lucifer cannon's chamber in the form of a sphere.

2)    Light photons are then frozen into the electrons of the helium while being spun.

3)    During all this, the air within the sphere of "helight" is siphoned out and ejected into the atmosphere causing the current sphere of "helight" to collapse on itself due to the vacuum of air in the center of the sphere.

4)    As the sphere collapses, a new sphere of "helight" is created in it's place almost instantly by the inner workings of the Lucifer Cannon, which are classified as top secret. This new sphere quickly collapses on itself too. If we freeze time here and look at the process so far, there is a very small sphere in the center of the lucifer cannon's chamber. This is not one sphere, but two because the first sphere is directly in the center and the next sphere is wrapped around it. This is held intact by it's constant spinning while more and more layers of "helight" are created and collapsed around the central sphere.

All this happens very quickly, building up the size of the central sphere until it is as big as a human skull.

5)    Before being released, the cannon inserts several pellets of very non-depleted uranium into the center of the sphere and then releases it through the barrel. The inside of the barrel has a very grippy substance on one side of the inside barrel. This one substance is meant for the ball of "helight" to catch on to and roll onto and accelerate itself a bit because of it's torque.

    [The effect doesn't work as well as calculated causing the released sphere to be quite slow. A new version is being worked on that releases the "helight" spheres faster than it's soon-to-be predecessor.]

    The current version's helight sphere buzzes along happily in whatever direction it was released until it collides with a solid object. Whatever the object may be, massive damage is incurred to it since the pellets of uranium have mixed and are, by now, a massive molten mass.

    This mass (located at the center of the sphere) is activated as soon as it leaves the cannon barrel triggering an explosion that is very similar to that of an atomic explosion in the sense that it in itself begins a chain reaction with its members. This explosion is contained inside the cage of "helight" until an object pierces the cage. When the cage is pierced, all the energy from the explosion is released through the hole where said object pierced the sphere. The helight sphere then dissipates in several seconds. One main problem during testing was that the explosion would always spread from the target when released, creating a splash effect where even if the intended target was missed by several meters, the spread of the explosion would reach and damage the target anyway. Because of the rush of the war however, the lucifer cannon was released without the mending of this problem. Scientists believe it serves marines well regardless.
                         
                                                         Addendum by Professor Chris. Robin Ph.d.

It seems that marines have been abusing the system of the Lucifer Cannon by disabling the safety lock. This safety lock stops the Helight sphere from being overcharged. Such an action means the layers of helight would build upon each other until too large for the cannon chamber to contain. In such a case the cage would break it's order, diffract into many small pieces and slip through the vent intended for extracted air to leave, thus damaging the user himself. It is possible to do this carefully and thus create a much larger projectile than intended for the Lucifer Cannon to eject before the helight sphere overcharges. Sources say it is working much more efficiently against the alien force. We have added a sound vent so you can hear the sound of the helight ball being constructed. As of now, the sound vent connects to your earpiece so only you can hear it; but on unreleased models, the sound vent no longer connects to your earpiece but vents directly from the cannon chamber so it is possible for other marines to hear you overcharge your cannon and make a run for it before you irriadiate yourself.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2009, 06:44:54 am by Winnie the Pooh »
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I also realize that this is the internet, but even more so this is the forum for a video game on an internet, then even beyond that this is TREMULOUS forums the Satan version of all video game forums for a video game that is ON the internet.

Bissig

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Re: Try of a realistic explaination of Tremulous' human's weapons
« Reply #89 on: April 15, 2009, 12:53:32 am »
Not to spoil your fantasy, BUT, you can not "freeze" photons. At least not with helium. You can slow down photons with certain meta materials, but that is all.