Tremulous Forum

Community => Off Topic => Topic started by: mooseberry on July 04, 2010, 09:58:36 am

Title: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on July 04, 2010, 09:58:36 am
ATTENTION: PLEASE READ ALL, VERY URGENT!

Dear Tremulous forum,

I have something serious to announce, so if you could put down your granger hurting weapons for a moment, and pay attention, I would really appreciate it.

This is about the problem of spambots. More specifically, what is being done to them, and what is being done about that. What is being done is a systematic targeted, specific, and deadly efficient deletion of all spambots who enter the realms of tremulous.net. Backed by his nefarious evil-government controlling group, the MG, or Menstrual Gyration (is this even possible?), Khalsa is leading a charge to wipe out any spambots he can lay his deadly hands on. He has recruited to help in his cause many previously-innocent members of the forum, who we presume have now been brainwashed. He has even gone so far as to appoint the members "spam killers" and give them a badge, rewarding those who are especially good at unrelenting murder. Appalling, I know.

Now that you know the problem, you should know the solution, and what is being done about. I will tell you what is being done about it: absolutely nothing. Until now. I know what everyone is going to say. The typical, "I don't consort with spambots, I didn't even realize they were being deleted." Well let me be the first to say: cowpoop. That excuse never has worked, and never will. A couple months ago, I was glad to realize that many tens of spam bots were creating accounts on the tremulous forums to experience our humble abode. But suddenly, they started disappearing. Now why did all of these spambots join up all of a sudden? Well I can't know for sure, since the said poor things were slain in cold blood before I had a chance to ask them. But with a deduction (a foreign type of poultry) based on certain things I saw, these spambots were likely seeking refuge in the tremulous.net fora, after being driven out of their homelands in other sites. I felt sorry for their plight, but was overjoyed with the chance to welcome them with open arms to our loving tremulous community, and I knew others felt the same way. Until I saw Khalsa. He was a relentless killer. By the scores, whole swathes of spambots were wiped out before they even had a chance. Did he ask them what they were doing? Did he give them any chance at all? Of course not. He is a destroyer of families like others from our past.

If you don't believe me, consider this. "Khalsa" = 6 letters. "Hitler" = 6 letters. MG = 2 letters (the same number of decades WWII occurred in, coincidence?) MG also sometimes claims their initials stands for Mercenaries Guild, which honestly is no better than their other name. Mercenary = a killer for hire, sound familiar? and Guild = a gathering of socialist anarchists bent on the destruction of among other things, God, the sanctity of marriage, and American football. Finally, Khalsa, rearranged, spells salahk, and because h= the 8th letter of the alphabet, and k= the 11th letter of the alphabet, you subtract 11-8=3+1(the number of souls khalsa has +1) you get 4. The fourth letter of the alphabet is d. So now, that spells salad, which, as you may or may not be aware, was invented by warmongering pretty boy Julius Ceaser.  Proof enough, I think. If you still need more evidence, fuck off, this isn't a university.

So what's going to happen next? Well we are going to let Khalsa and his band of killers know that we wont tolerate this for another moment. He has committed too many wrongs, (remember this? (http://tremulous.net/forum/index.php?topic=12887.0)) and must be stopped. I don't care what you do (as long as there aren't too many sequins or hot pockets involved) just show your support for this cause! Let him know you do not condone this act of genocide, and not only do you not support it, but you are firmly opposed, and will do something to oppose him, maybe make a youtube video of you killing some turtles and growling "this will be you next" (disclaimer: if you actually do kill any turtles, I am not in any way responsible).

To try to hammer home just how important cause this is, and how horrible the plight of the spambots is, I present to you a PM I sent to a spambot on this here forum, cleverly named "sofinam69"

Quote
Hello there sofinam69, I saw some of your posts and I must admit I was instantly won over by your humor and charm. Your witty dialogous, such as "music way of life," your lack of correct punctiation, and your wonderful website links in your signature are very amazing. I feel that we share a special connection, and was hoping you feel the same way and that we could be friends.

Awaiting your reply, Mooseberry.

I was very excited to start a great relationship between us two, but sadly I never received a reply back. And why you ask? Did I go too heavy on the early compliments? No, no, this had nothing to do with my advancements, but when I checked my PM status later, I noticed that THERE WAS NO ACCOUNT LEFT. This offer of friendship is the last surviving testament to the existence of such a beautiful spambot, who was snuffed out of existence at the prime of its life by Khalsa. What a horrid thing. I cried for a week, and than drowned my sorrows by making 3000 tremulous maps featuring artwork of khalsa being deleted by spambots. Unfortunately my hard drive crashed, and all I have left of that idea are nightmares.

So... the solution to these problems? Well, the first step is obviously, as I have said, to raise awareness and support for the poor spambots who never could (because their hearts were ripped out by a punjabi cowboy). After we have made it clear we support the right to existence of spambots, we will make it clear to Khalsa that either he relents on this killer crusade, or we must impeach him from office of killing. (I don't think he does anything else). After coming to agreement with the dictator, we must establish a safeland for the persecuted, as the Jews received after WWII. So where will that be, I hear you asking. Well first of all, I was just about to answer that, so stop asking so many fucking questions. And mainly, I decided (along with the help of a great medical station [something else Khalsa believes doesn't have emotions, and decons without mercy, but that's another topic]) that spambots need and deserve a board as their own to call home. Now obviously, Khalsa will have enough on his hands recuperating from the realization of what he has done, so I wouldn't want to put the work of creating a new board or sub-board on his shoulders. Instead, an already existing board must be used as the safe grounds for the spambots. After discussion with many well respected Tremulous authorities, we decided the best spot would be the Developer Corner. Not only is it geometrically a secure feeling place, but as far as we are able to determine, it is not being used for anything else.

That is all for now folks, if you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask (giant, red, font is probably the best way to get my attention) and most importantly of all, post to make it clear to the spambots you are ON THEIR SIDE too! They have feelings too, and will really appreciate the support you give them.

With love in my heart, and hope in my fists (I had to move it after 1.2 burned out my normal holding spot), this is mooseberry, saying Thank you for reading.

Thank you.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: CreatureofHell on July 04, 2010, 10:09:44 am
After reading this topic there has been awakened in me a strong desire for vengeance. I, like mooseberry, enjoy the spambots and their beautifully written posts. Most of them are even better at posting than most of the members on this forum. I deeply object to this cruel and heartless genocide of a people who just want to settle down and find a forum where they are accepted by the community as a greater whole.

We cannot continue to reject these poor beings without them developing a hatred for internet users as a whole and using generalizations and grouping their friends with their enemies. This constant threat from the community is a terrible thing to live with.

We cannot continue to ruin the lives of these wonderful people who pour so much work into communities only to be shunned and cast out. We must fight to regain their rights and prevent more of these deaths from occuring!
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on July 04, 2010, 10:24:47 am
I support this full heartedly, please for all of you who support this cause add this to your signature "मैं स्पैम बॉट समर्थन" which is hindi for "I support spam bot." For the love of the hindi language, for the love of spambots put it in! Remember, only you can prevent genocide! Khalsa, along with the spam killers need to be stopped, we must let them know that we want spambots to be treated as our equals! No longer shall we just sit, and watch these injustices happen before our eyes! We must get up, and fight! Aliens, and humans unite, against the third race{MG}! Spambots have feelings too, and even if they don't that doesn't stop us from pretending they do! Spambots deserve better than death, save the spambots, and they too can experience tremulous.net as we do!
मैं स्पैम बॉट समर्थन
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Crava_Loft on July 04, 2010, 12:20:28 pm
[deleted]
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: CreatureofHell on July 04, 2010, 12:36:32 pm
If you like spam you can always find one of those forsaken forums.

I'm sorry you feel that way but those forsaken forums lack a community for the spambots to feel at home in and therefore they can't settle down and enjoy civilisation. They need a home to welcome them and who will actively engage them in the discussion that they crave.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: your face on July 04, 2010, 05:16:34 pm
KILL ALL SPAMBOTS

I HAVE SEEN FIRSTHAND WHAT THESE PUTRID BEINGS DO TO INNOCENT FORUMS AND IT IS, BELIEVE ME, NOT A PRETTY SITE, SIGHT.

DO NOT LET THEM FOOL YOU WITH THEIR INNOCENT FACES AND PRETTY POSTS.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: CorSair on July 04, 2010, 06:20:33 pm
I'll leave meself out of this....
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: your face on July 04, 2010, 09:24:17 pm
I'll leave meself out of this....

YOU HAVE ALREADY JOINED.  BUT WHICH SIDE ARE YOU ON?
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: DeadMeat on July 05, 2010, 01:43:38 am
why do you hurt friend spambot?
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Minimum on July 05, 2010, 01:48:09 am
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: condor on July 05, 2010, 03:16:22 am
why do you hurt friend spambot?

Conzul whip up a friend spambot for mooseberry
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Conzul on July 05, 2010, 05:00:45 am
why do you hurt friend spambot?

Conzul whip up a friend spambot for mooseberry

[Conzul concetrates very hard...loud puffing noise]

"Hi everyone, first post.  :D :D :D :D
Before I talk about tremulous, I'd like to talk with you about everyone affected by the tsunami of last month in India. These people have lost everything, and as members of the human race, it is our responsibility to donate everything we can to help them in their time of need. Please consider a small donation. Here is my personal PayPal Account (http://Here is my personal PayPal Account) Your donation will go to charity, I promise.

 Now, I like tremulous, it is a great game  8) 8) :o ;D :D  :basilisk:  :battlesuit:
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on July 06, 2010, 07:27:50 pm
why do you hurt friend spambot?

Conzul whip up a friend spambot for mooseberry

[Conzul concetrates very hard...loud puffing noise]

"Hi everyone, first post.  :D :D :D :D
Before I talk about tremulous, I'd like to talk with you about everyone affected by the tsunami of last month in India. These people have lost everything, and as members of the human race, it is our responsibility to donate everything we can to help them in their time of need. Please consider a small donation. Here is my personal PayPal Account (http://Here is my personal PayPal Account) Your donation will go to charity, I promise.

 Now, I like tremulous, it is a great game  8) 8) :o ;D :D  :basilisk:  :battlesuit:
okay i just gave you all my monei now waht?
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Conzul on July 06, 2010, 07:30:52 pm
why do you hurt friend spambot?

Conzul whip up a friend spambot for mooseberry

[Conzul concetrates very hard...loud puffing noise]

"Hi everyone, first post.  :D :D :D :D
Before I talk about tremulous, I'd like to talk with you about everyone affected by the tsunami of last month in India. These people have lost everything, and as members of the human race, it is our responsibility to donate everything we can to help them in their time of need. Please consider a small donation. Here is my personal PayPal Account (http://Here is my personal PayPal Account) Your donation will go to charity, I promise.

 Now, I like tremulous, it is a great game  8) 8) :o ;D :D  :basilisk:  :battlesuit:
okay i just gave you all my monei now waht?

Now, you get to feel good about yourself. You didn't expect something back, did you? Silly little bear......
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: DraZiLoX on July 06, 2010, 11:03:40 pm
KILL ALL CAPS LOCK USERS!
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: your face on July 06, 2010, 11:17:24 pm
NO
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: CreatureofHell on July 07, 2010, 10:06:27 pm
KILL ALL CAPS LOCK USERS!
/me stabs.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: DraZiLoX on July 09, 2010, 11:38:06 pm
You damn racist! Stab your face too (and your own face : D)!
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on July 10, 2010, 03:52:50 am
why do you hurt friend spambot?

Conzul whip up a friend spambot for mooseberry

[Conzul concetrates very hard...loud puffing noise]

"Hi everyone, first post.  :D :D :D :D
Before I talk about tremulous, I'd like to talk with you about everyone affected by the tsunami of last month in India. These people have lost everything, and as members of the human race, it is our responsibility to donate everything we can to help them in their time of need. Please consider a small donation. Here is my personal PayPal Account (http://Here is my personal PayPal Account) Your donation will go to charity, I promise.

 Now, I like tremulous, it is a great game  8) 8) :o ;D :D  :basilisk:  :battlesuit:
okay i just gave you all my monei now waht?

Now, you get to feel good about yourself. You didn't expect something back, did you? Silly little bear......
but im not abare!!! im a medicstacion1!!!!1! why us say im scarey bare
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: kharnov on July 12, 2010, 03:12:01 am
(http://i29.tinypic.com/5195ea.jpg)

Dudes and gentlemen, this scene will be repeated forever until we stop Khalsa from these horrific acts once and for all. Please, donate to Save the Whales. Your monthly contribution can make a difference.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Squidophanes on July 12, 2010, 10:56:47 am
[snippity]

Dudes and gentlemen, this scene will be repeated forever until we stop Khalsa from these horrific acts once and for all. Please, donate to Save the Whales. Your monthly contribution can make a difference.


(http://i.imgur.com/WjzQ0.png)


I made it better. You're welcome.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: A Spork on July 15, 2010, 06:55:39 am
Oh. My. Word.

This thread is awesome.
Best laugh I've had in days.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on July 16, 2010, 07:00:09 pm
[snippity]

Dudes and gentlemen, this scene will be repeated forever until we stop Khalsa from these horrific acts once and for all. Please, donate to Save the Whales. Your monthly contribution can make a difference.


(http://imgur.com/J0O4w.png)


I made it better. You're welcome.
fix'd
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: your face on July 16, 2010, 07:10:19 pm
MAPS
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: BlackX32 on July 17, 2010, 01:08:00 am
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
I don't wear hats so should I be killed? Oh and before this forum I had a spambot friend. I didn't know but one day he told me and let me say this: I still treated him like a human. He was fun and hilarious. Some are good and some are bad. Find out which are what before you go and kill them.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on July 17, 2010, 03:31:18 am
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
I don't wear hats so should I be killed? Oh and before this forum I had a spambot friend. I didn't know but one day he told me and let me say this: I still treated him like a human. He was fun and hilarious. Some are good and some are bad. Find out which are what before you go and kill them.

Good point. We should all remember this.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: BlackX32 on July 18, 2010, 05:54:04 pm
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
I don't wear hats so should I be killed? Oh and before this forum I had a spambot friend. I didn't know but one day he told me and let me say this: I still treated him like a human. He was fun and hilarious. Some are good and some are bad. Find out which are what before you go and kill them.

Good point. We should all remember this.

I say that if we could keep the bad spambots away and let the good come and play then this forum would be awsome. this forum would be rich and full of fun, games, and ideas. so why not eh. I WILL FIGHT FOR GOOD SPAMBOT RIGHTS
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on July 29, 2010, 09:06:13 pm
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
I don't wear hats so should I be killed? Oh and before this forum I had a spambot friend. I didn't know but one day he told me and let me say this: I still treated him like a human. He was fun and hilarious. Some are good and some are bad. Find out which are what before you go and kill them.

Good point. We should all remember this.
f1
I say that if we could keep the bad spambots away and let the good come and play then this forum would be awsome. this forum would be rich and full of fun, games, and ideas. so why not eh. I WILL FIGHT FOR GOOD SPAMBOT RIGHTS
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Hindenburg on July 29, 2010, 09:28:25 pm
Khalsa, rearranged, spells salahk, and because h= the 8th letter of the alphabet, and k= the 11th letter of the alphabet, you subtract 11-8=3+1(the number of souls khalsa has +1) you get 4. The fourth letter of the alphabet is d. So now, that spells salad, which, as you may or may not be aware, was invented by warmongering pretty boy Julius Ceaser.
New discovery!! Since h=8 and k=11, 11+8=4.75(3+1) gets you 19. The 19th letter of the alphabet is s, making Khalsa into Salsa. Salsa is hot and it burns. Khalsa is going to burn the spambots!
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: BlackX32 on August 07, 2010, 08:01:38 pm
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
I don't wear hats so should I be killed? Oh and before this forum I had a spambot friend. I didn't know but one day he told me and let me say this: I still treated him like a human. He was fun and hilarious. Some are good and some are bad. Find out which are what before you go and kill them.

Good point. We should all remember this.
f1
I say that if we could keep the bad spambots away and let the good come and play then this forum would be awsome. this forum would be rich and full of fun, games, and ideas. so why not eh. I WILL FIGHT FOR GOOD SPAMBOT RIGHTS
wut's with the f1
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: CreatureofHell on August 07, 2010, 10:28:43 pm
Kill all spambots. They are evil, and they don't wear hats.
I don't wear hats so should I be killed? Oh and before this forum I had a spambot friend. I didn't know but one day he told me and let me say this: I still treated him like a human. He was fun and hilarious. Some are good and some are bad. Find out which are what before you go and kill them.

Good point. We should all remember this.
f1
I say that if we could keep the bad spambots away and let the good come and play then this forum would be awsome. this forum would be rich and full of fun, games, and ideas. so why not eh. I WILL FIGHT FOR GOOD SPAMBOT RIGHTS
wut's with the f1
I think he wanted to type that as his post and failed. :P
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: jez on August 07, 2010, 10:51:27 pm
[snip]
wut's with the f1

f1 is the default yes bind for an in game vote. Basically means he agrees.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on August 08, 2010, 03:31:34 am
Spambot Genocide. Never forgive, never forget.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: BlackX32 on August 09, 2010, 01:20:35 am
i still haven't
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on August 19, 2010, 10:17:12 pm
Khalsa, rearranged, spells salahk, and because h= the 8th letter of the alphabet, and k= the 11th letter of the alphabet, you subtract 11-8=3+1(the number of souls khalsa has +1) you get 4. The fourth letter of the alphabet is d. So now, that spells salad, which, as you may or may not be aware, was invented by warmongering pretty boy Julius Ceaser.
New discovery!! Since h=8 and k=11, 11+8=4.75(3+1) gets you 19. The 19th letter of the alphabet is s, making Khalsa into Salsa. Salsa is hot and it burns. Khalsa is going to burn the spambots!
wow, that is just plain genius
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: khalsa on August 20, 2010, 04:00:31 am
http://khalsa.mercenariesguild.net/junk/before.png
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on August 20, 2010, 04:15:36 am
http://khalsa.mercenariesguild.net/junk/before.png
i don't quite get your point.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on August 20, 2010, 04:41:22 am
http://khalsa.mercenariesguild.net/junk/before.png
i don't quite get your point.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/cia-realizes-its-been-using-black-highlighters-all,1848/ (http://www.theonion.com/articles/cia-realizes-its-been-using-black-highlighters-all,1848/)
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: khalsa on August 20, 2010, 05:13:40 am
http://khalsa.mercenariesguild.net/junk/after.png
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: ziplocpeople on August 20, 2010, 05:23:15 am
http://khalsa.mercenariesguild.net/junk/after.png
wow, you showed before and after his post... that is very interesting. please, share more knowledge with us.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: khalsa on August 21, 2010, 01:18:54 pm
wow, you showed before and after his post... that is very interesting. please, share more knowledge with us.

This my friends, is how you get away with "genocide".
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: swamp-cecil on August 22, 2010, 02:51:11 am
i dont understand what this i all about. is it like people making accounts on tremulous.ner, and keep visiting it so the the website gets more internet traffic and they become bankrupt?
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on August 22, 2010, 04:15:09 am
i dont understand what this i all about. is it like people making accounts on tremulous.ner, and keep visiting it so the the website gets more internet traffic and they become bankrupt?

Well it's very simple see, the more people come, the more traffic they generate, as you said. The problem with this is more traffic leads to many more fatal automotive accidents, which can lead to liability lawsuits against tremulous.ner, thus leading them to become bankrupt.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: khalsa on August 22, 2010, 05:55:49 am
After I killed Over 4000 the other night, I'm feeling pretty good. Sometime in the near future I will slay the remaining several hundred. Better watch out!
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: your face on August 22, 2010, 06:25:31 am
Go get 'em.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Knowitall66 on August 22, 2010, 07:12:49 am
My God! Was there seriously that many? Also, seems most of them were female...
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: swamp-cecil on August 22, 2010, 09:38:32 pm
and how can i find the spambots? i feel like helping
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Crava_Loft on August 22, 2010, 11:49:20 pm
<bburbans> I think Timbo has a highlight for "fuck"
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on September 19, 2010, 01:42:32 am
Just as a warning: this issue has not gone away. In fact, the lack of spambots only means Khalsa's killings are successful.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Nux on September 19, 2010, 02:56:29 am
You could be grossly misunderstanding the situation.

Maybe Khalsa was just killing all the girls.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: your face on September 19, 2010, 05:52:23 am
also KHALSA, you deleted Mars' account.  He had made a post, yet his account was still deleted.

sloppy genocide job.
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: mooseberry on September 19, 2010, 05:58:31 am
also KHALSA, you deleted Mars' account.  He had made a post, yet his account was still deleted.

sloppy genocide job.

Quote from: Niemöller
They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came...)
Title: Re: Spambots: Khalsa's New Genocide
Post by: Nux on September 19, 2010, 03:42:34 pm
Sorry, I didn't catch that. Could you speak up?