Author Topic: Banning and kicking ultimate solution  (Read 7447 times)

sleekslacker

  • Posts: 407
  • Turrets: +10/-35
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« on: June 27, 2006, 12:25:48 pm »
We need to make banning and kicking a bit painful for the griefers. Here is my suggestion :

1) Make a GUID login in the game client, so that the gamer needs to enter his number ( let's make it a mix of alphanumeric! a meaningful name limits its available quantity and people try hard to get their own special name ).

i.e.: GUID: 287*&G"(&*82£@

2) To get the GUID, the client needs to register his nickname on a website (same server as GUID server, but different port maybe). The nickname will be used in the game. The player can't change this name in the game. It can be changed again on the website. And we'll have a lot of captcha images for registering/changing name. Maybe 4 or 5. This should slow repetitive griefers down.

Register form:
Nickname: Sleek
Email: .......@gmail.com
password: ******** ( for later change )
[captcha images here]
<returns a valid GUID, which is also entered in the database>

Login form:
Email: .......@gmail.com
password: ********
[captcha images here]
<allows player to change nickname>

3) GUID server holds a database of GUID and servers registered there. Yes server that wants to use this server needs to be registered as well. Of course, it's optional for them ( in case they just don't care ). Actually server database contains the banned GUID list.

GUID db:

 
GUID               Name
=========================
287*&G"(&*82£@     Sleek


server db:
 
Server              Banned GUID          Kickvoter       Reason      Period
==============================================
<serverID here>      /Ss7+_"(&*c24%    287*&G"(&*82£@    deconning  4 hours
                    3k!ad''a**m3qlp     287*&G"(&*82£@    TK         8 hours


(just an example, there could be more columns in this db)

3) When the player needs to enter a game (server), the client dials back to the GUID server and check if his number is banned on that game server. If it's, he is kicked back, else he's in.

4) Now we need to repair the voting system for kicking and banning. We need a 'reason' part to it. This will be sent to the GUID server along with the person who started the vote, and the person kicked, if the kick/ban succeeded. This way, if any misvoting occured and the kicked person reports, there's evidence which we can see who's in the wrong.

5) Of course the GUID server address should be changeable by the user, so we can have several GUID server (if users wanted to have their own, which could be clan based (stricter ?) or n00b based (leanient, however you spell it :) ). But users from GUID server A shouldn't be able to access
game servers listed in GUID server B.

The only way to eliminate people taking advantage of the system is to slow them enough while we repair the damage they have done. There is no 100% solution that can stop them dead. But we can slow them down to almost a halt. :)

That's my idea. It's a bit complicated, thanks to these griefers. If people would play fair everytime things would have been much easier. Some might argue that using db will slow things down. This shouldn't be the case if the db access is kept to minimum, i.e. not a lot of kick/banning is done.
Now you die griefers :evil: .

I hope you like my first post.
y last name is Jones, the family motto is "Jones' never give up!"

Currently ignoring all of your spams.

Henners

  • Posts: 383
  • Turrets: +10/-5
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2006, 12:54:50 pm »
Thats fine for dedicated players. But its too complicated, and would put off new players.

And griefers could just sit and register a load of ids in one go, then work their way through them rather than registering one each time they get banned.
Official Ace Forum Attorney. If your post is stupid I will object...

sleekslacker

  • Posts: 407
  • Turrets: +10/-35
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2006, 01:13:17 pm »
that's why we get their email address.. unique email address is needed per account. Registering new email addresses is quite a hassle. We can have email activation, which eliminates fake email addresses problem.

We can also have an IP lock for 10 mins in the website, so that the same person can't register for new GUID that soon. This is only for the web interface. In game GUID server shouldn't have this IP lock.

It's complicated for new users yes. But we do want dedicated users don't we ? :) Plus, if you can get your friend to know this game, we have you as the guide. So you should be responsible teaching them not to decon :). Nah just kidding.
y last name is Jones, the family motto is "Jones' never give up!"

Currently ignoring all of your spams.

sleekslacker

  • Posts: 407
  • Turrets: +10/-35
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2006, 01:29:13 pm »
We can also put a delay before they can activate the account, maybe 1 hour. And guess what, kicking/banning each of their account takes approx. 1 min. so if they have 4 premade accounts with 4 different email addresses, it takes only 4 times discrete 1 mins to keep them out of the game. If they decide to create a new account and decon with a new email address they have to

1) create a new email address
2) wait for an hour before they can activate and join
3) decon a base for maybe 10 mins
4) get kicked out of the game
5) wait for another hour

this should demotivate any griefers.

dedicated ppl shouldn't have any problem with this. All it takes for them is to register with an existing email account, enter some random captcha numbers according to the image, and they're in forever. No hassles after that, unless they've been misvoted by somebody else.

Deleting an existing GUID should be made by an email requests, so that griefers cant just delete their GUID and create a new one using the same email address.

Hell I think this *can* work !
y last name is Jones, the family motto is "Jones' never give up!"

Currently ignoring all of your spams.

[EVIL]Unknown

  • Posts: 263
  • Turrets: +1/-1
    • http://www.evil-clan.com
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2006, 01:36:04 pm »
meh i dont like the whole cant change name withought having to go to webiste thing

im someone who likes to change his name ingame... im an alias whore so yeah i like my name changing binds dont take them away...
url=http://userbars.org][/url]


sleekslacker

  • Posts: 407
  • Turrets: +10/-35
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2006, 01:42:42 pm »
Well, fine. We shall allow nick change within the game. Then we'll have to make the kick/ban vote by GUID instead of by name. Identification of griefers will also need to be done by looking at GUID instead of name.

Go on, find all weakness to this method and post here pls. Even if this doesn't get into the game I might be using this method for some other things I'm developing. I need to get back to real life.
y last name is Jones, the family motto is "Jones' never give up!"

Currently ignoring all of your spams.

Dutchman@SRM

  • Posts: 3
  • Turrets: +0/-0
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2006, 01:54:05 pm »
Allegiance has a system where each person can only make only 3 account regardless of how many email u have they use the ip to track you down, also they have a very good system of having adimnatrators for the banning that can take up any lenght of time, and the player themselve can boot a player from game and lock him out unless he changes his name.  you could go to freeallegiance.org to get advice from the maker of Free alligance.

Quaoar

  • Posts: 152
  • Turrets: +1/-0
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2006, 03:24:39 pm »
Quote from: "sleekslacker"
Well, fine. We shall allow nick change within the game. Then we'll have to make the kick/ban vote by GUID instead of by name. Identification of griefers will also need to be done by looking at GUID instead of name.

Go on, find all weakness to this method and post here pls. Even if this doesn't get into the game I might be using this method for some other things I'm developing. I need to get back to real life.


So long as the GUID is immediately visible on the TAB screen, that might be ok.

Though it may be worth sacrificing name changing for the sake of quick identification. The current problem is that griefers just change names and poof, they're someone else and you have no idea.

bsel

  • Posts: 26
  • Turrets: +0/-0
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2006, 05:19:20 pm »
Here is one reason against email addresses: http://www.trash-mail.de
And here another one: http://www.sofort-mail.de/
If you have your own SMTP-server: Here is one too: blabasuelz@your-server.ownz
helldretch

sleekslacker

  • Posts: 407
  • Turrets: +10/-35
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2006, 07:16:20 pm »
Quote from: "bsel"
Here is one reason against email addresses: http://www.trash-mail.de
And here another one: http://www.sofort-mail.de/
If you have your own SMTP-server: Here is one too: blabasuelz@your-server.ownz


From what I understand these hosts provide "black-hole" address for emails, is that right ? In the case of email activation, people will actually need to receive, open and use the url in the email. Having a valid email address doesn't suffice.
y last name is Jones, the family motto is "Jones' never give up!"

Currently ignoring all of your spams.

Quaoar

  • Posts: 152
  • Turrets: +1/-0
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2006, 08:10:46 pm »
Quote from: "sleekslacker"
Quote from: "bsel"
Here is one reason against email addresses: http://www.trash-mail.de
And here another one: http://www.sofort-mail.de/
If you have your own SMTP-server: Here is one too: blabasuelz@your-server.ownz


From what I understand these hosts provide "black-hole" address for emails, is that right ? In the case of email activation, people will actually need to receive, open and use the url in the email. Having a valid email address doesn't suffice.


www.mailinator.com

I use it all the time for activitation.

Though certain sites don't permit such junk email addresses like @mailinator.com and whatnot, I don't see why that can't be extended to this.

AND we need to remember who we're dealing with here. If a griefer isn't braindead, I don't see what reason he has to be a griefer. Make it take a little too much effort, and they'll move along to something else they can piss people off in.

sleekslacker

  • Posts: 407
  • Turrets: +10/-35
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2006, 08:48:06 pm »
lol disposable mail forwarding service. I didn't think of that. :D

I think it's quite easy for admins to identify repetitive griefers and ban these hostnames, right ? Email hosts such as mailinator.com can be considered against the server rules because we know the account will have an invalid email address associated with it after a while. Put it in the 'not allowed list', warn if registration detects the hosts, otherwise proceed as usual.

Haha sorry if you think I'm answering all your questions with further complex methods. But I think this is needed to form a solid solution for this problem. I believe the trick is to make it a hassle for bad people and make it swift for people who obey to the rules.
y last name is Jones, the family motto is "Jones' never give up!"

Currently ignoring all of your spams.

Stof

  • Posts: 1343
  • Turrets: +1/-1
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2006, 09:23:13 am »
Don't make it difficult for new players to play the game for the sake of making it difficult for noob griefers to mess with the game. Dedicated griefers ( which looks like the kind we have on trem anyway ) will not be affected too much by that.
urphy's rules of combat
8 ) Teamwork is essential; it gives the enemy someone else to shoot at.
18 ) Make it too tough for the enemy to get in and you can't get out.

Chaos Weevil

  • Posts: 29
  • Turrets: +0/-0
Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2006, 12:44:54 am »
Nah, I prefer it the way it is now.  IMO, Tremulous is fun, and sure I hate griefers, but I wouldn't go though all that hassle just to play Trem when I can get onto UT2k4 game in six clicks.

And it would put off new users, so a decrease in user base, plus no incoming users = game not so fun anymore...
ot changing this sig until I get Spore

Fluffy

  • Posts: 7
  • Turrets: +0/-0
    • http://pp.siedziba.pl
Re: Banning and kicking ultimate solution
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2006, 02:32:33 am »
Quote from: "sleekslacker"

3) When the player needs to enter a game (server), the client dials back to the GUID server and check if his number is banned on that game server. If it's, he is kicked back, else he's in.


So, this is client based? Client based bans never work. However, if you wanted to say that the game server connects to the GUID server and checks the number, this would also be a bad idea. An attacked could host a game server to collect GUIDs, then use them to grief on other servers, causing legitimate players to be banned. You need a scheme of passing not the GUID, but a one time ticket, as I suggested some time ago in this thread:

http://tremulous.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=3810#3810