SUGESTUN! [Wallwalking on map entities]

[Plague Bringer]

hai guiz!!!!!!!11111!! im kinda new 2 the game but i love it!!!! dretch stormmm! kekekeke
anywayy i think we shuld b abel 2 walwlk on da entitys liek the om   and stuf u kno?

Ahem. Legit suggestion. I'm sure there's a reason we can't, though. Any thoughts?

[kevlarman]

hai guiz!!!!!!!11111!! im kinda new 2 the game but i love it!!!! dretch stormmm! kekekeke
anywayy i think we shuld b abel 2 walwlk on da entitys liek the om  and stuf u kno?

Ahem. Legit suggestion. I'm sure there's a reason we can't, though. Any thoughts?

risujin did implement this a while ago, but it caused more problems than it was worth iirc.

[Plague Bringer]

risujin did implement this a while ago, but it caused more problems than it was worth iirc.

Do you remember what, exactly? I take it it'd be a little funky on funk_doors and trains. (c wat i did thar?) (But on static ents it should be feasible, and I'm sure there's a way of determining a difference between static and dynamic entities, and (dis)allowing wallwalking appropriately. That being said, I've got no coding knowledge and am just yanking guesses from my rear.)

It's pretty gimmiky, really. No particular need for it, but it's just one of those things that (perhaps, as a newcomer to the game) you'd think (expect, maybe?) would be possible..

[mooseberry]

There was something about the bounding boxes and client/server communication, and bla bla bla. But basically it was kind of glitchy. Who knows, maybe someone will have a magical solution though.

[David]

As I recall it was something about player locations being clipped to ints, and buildings not being aligned to ints, so you got tons of prediction errors and it went all nutso.  (The world is aligned to ints so it's fine there)

Or I could be totally wrong.


Risujin's go at it is probably still in mgdev's git somewhere if you want to play with it.

[bob0]

hai guiz!!!!!!!11111!! im kinda new 2 the game but i love it!!!! dretch stormmm! kekekeke
anywayy i think we shuld b abel 2 walwlk on da entitys liek the om  and stuf u kno?

Ahem. Legit suggestion. I'm sure there's a reason we can't, though. Any thoughts?

I accidentally introduced this in the new domination mod, which I've ported, merged, and updated from Risujin's domination.  Players can wallwalk on other players and buildables, but it's pretty difficult as a dretch to even start climbing on a moving human; if he moves, you'll usually fall off pretty quickly.  I haven't noticed any oddities.  Nobody's mentioned anything about it, so I don't think anybody has noticed it yet.

[Demolution]

This is also possible on KoRx. A granger can easily traverse the OM or other players, but it's easiest on stationary entities AFAIK.

We also need grappling hooks to counter this. :>

[Conzul]

I think dretches should be able to ride goons horsey style, and launch off in battle like catapults into human base

[kevlarman]

I think dretches should be able to ride marauders horsey style, and launch off in battle like catapults into human base

fixed

[Conzul]

I think dretches should be able to ride marauders horsey style, and launch off in battle like catapults into human base

fixed

Naahhh, too close in size. Besides, you're the ones who named it a "Dragoon". Traditionally a horse-mounted cavalry. I think an Adv. Goon sould have two hardpoints that two dretches can attach to, and they can jump off anytime, feeding on the inertia of the dragoon, like dretchbombs!

[Demolution]

kevlarman was referring to an old joke.

[Norfenstein]

Another reason is a lot of the models don't line up exactly with their bounding boxes, so you'd get dretches appearing to wall walk on air with some of them.

[Plague Bringer]

Another reason is a lot of the models don't line up exactly with their bounding boxes, so you'd get dretches appearing to wall walk on air with some of them.

Wow. I cannot believe I didn't think of that! -.-

[Winnie the Pooh]

An example would be a dretch on the back of a rant. All the space in between its head and tail that is not part of its body is still part of it's bbox.

[Plague Bringer]

An example would be a dretch on the back of a rant. All the space in between its head and tail that is not part of its body is still part of it's bbox.

Yeah, yeah. Hahaha.

[UniqPhoeniX]

Being able to wallwalk on entities other then players/buildings would be nice. No 'walking on air' or prediction errors there I think? Cuz there are no errors while you are on an elevator, why would there be if you were below it?

[KillerWhale]

This is why you can't wallwalk on other players:

Yes, those basis are floating in midair.


That is a basi crawling on top of the ceiling of the ATCS outside, after crawling up into the air with another basi to get to the ceiling.

While it may not seem like much to have two basilisks crawl up each-other to get to the ceiling of ATCS, the implications for grangers would be massive.
EVERYTHING would have to be nobuilt, to prevent sky-eggs and whatnot.

So basically, keeping players from wallcrawling on each-other is a good way to save a lot of mappers a lot of grief.

[bob0]

That was really difficult to do, and it took a long time to even start getting in the air.  Both of them can't walk at the same time; they need to inch their way up very slowly, and, needless to say, it's very slow.  This doesn't work with g_shove on.

No, mappers don't need to nobuild anything, because usually single wallwalkers usually can get up on a ceiling at S2 much easier and much much faster than with another granger.  Karith no-wallwalked its sky correctly.  The only "decent" map that hasn't is atcs, which is the only map really affected, and even then, eggs built on the sky can be easily destroyed.

This barely affects gameplay / balance, while making the game slightly funner.  Being able to wallwalk slowly with somebody else in the air doesn't change much at all.  And if you think you doubt this, go try playing domination yourself.

[mooseberry]

That was really difficult to do, and it took a long time to even start getting in the air.  Both of them can't walk at the same time; they need to inch their way up very slowly, and, needless to say, it's very slow.  This doesn't work with g_shove on.

No, mappers don't need to nobuild anything, because usually single wallwalkers usually can get up on a ceiling at S2 much easier and much much faster than with another granger.  Karith no-wallwalked its sky correctly.  The only "decent" map that hasn't is atcs, which is the only map really affected, and even then, eggs built on the sky can be easily destroyed.

This barely affects gameplay / balance, while making the game slightly funner.  Being able to wallwalk slowly with somebody else in the air doesn't change much at all.  And if you think you doubt this, go try playing domination yourself.

1. The fact that it might take a couple minutes to complete does not excuse the fact of the matter.

2. I think you are confused here. No skys can be wallwalked, unless done really poorly, but any can be with this new feature.

3. Yes it will.

[bob0]

1. The fact that it might take a couple minutes to complete does not excuse the fact of the matter.

I was wrong!  Thanks for correcting me

2. I think you are confused here. No skys can be wallwalked, unless done really poorly, but any can be with this new feature.

[/quote]
Once again, I sit corrected.  I overlooked this: grangers can build on skies by climbing on the underside of another granger.

3. Yes it will.

Well... I doubt it affects gameplay much; I've never seen it used in a real game.  I'm very open to convincing, however.

Being able to do this on domination was unintentional, and I'll probably look into fixing it, especially if it becomes a big problem.