Change Mara Zap

[Conzul]

I have an idea to make chained lighting different. I think this would serve alien teamwork better, and because I think that it's OP anyway. This idea would also give the DC more strategic importance than it now has. This idea only applies to human base structures.
>> Zap will damage and freeze the targeted structure, and freeze chained structures for a brief time (1-2 seconds) without damaging them. This would stop the   from being a one-alien base renovator. Humans rarely can take out a full alien base by one human, unlike marauder zap.
>>   DC, when built, will negate the freeze effect of chained lightning, of structures within its range. This means that the mara would only damage (and not freeze) the structure that it targeted mainly, and (possibly)not chain to nearby targets. I also think the DC heal rate should be more like 4 or 5 HP/sec, but that's something else.

This means several things. For one, it becomes way more important for aliens to take out the DC, and way more important for humans to build it asap to stop as2. Next, it means that when aliens coordinate their attack (even loosely) that freeze will allow dretches and other weaklings to momentarily bypass base defenses, thereby rewarding teamwork with opportunity. Both of these effects are good things, IMO.
I've tried to kill 2 birds with this stone, the bird of   OPness (smaller bird), and the bird of lack of teamwork incentive for aliens(bigger bird). (Alien skill tends toward John Wayne-ness)

[F50]

Changing the way mara zap works will change the way humans build bases. How do you intend to maintain the current balance by nerfing the (not necessarily overpowered) marauder? Even if the marauder is overpowered, surely this will effect human and alien win/loss chances.

[Conzul]

Changing the way mara zap works will change the way humans build bases.

Not necessarily. Zap will still chain to nearby targets unless a DC is up near them, I don't see base building strategy changing that much at all.

How do you intend to maintain the current balance by nerfing the (not necessarily overpowered) marauder? Even if the marauder is overpowered, surely this will effect human and alien win/loss chances.

This doesn't really nerf the Marauder that much. It will still be potent against foot soldiers, and when attacking bases it will be able to stun defenses that otherwise would have been working to take it down. Before - or after - this change, the Adv. Marauder still has the edge against bases. The numbers probably won't change at all.

[A Spork]

So you're essentially saying make the chain function useless? But that's the whole dang point really..

Humans rarely can take out a full alien base by one human, unlike marauder zap.

*cough*
psaw + helmet + larmour + nade = fairly ded alien base if not built properly(same as h base vs. Mara+)

[Conzul]

So you're essentially saying make the chain function useless? But that's the whole dang point really..

Useless? How is the ability to freeze turrets and teslas useless? If you attack alone, you have the luxury of damaging your main target while stunning nearby defenses so they don't attack you. If you lead a group, you freeze defenses and thereby increase the damage value of every alien who follows you into the human base. So what if there's a DC? take it out! That's not so hard.

Humans rarely can take out a full alien base by one human, unlike marauder zap.

*cough*
psaw + helmet + larmour + nade = fairly ded alien base if not built properly(same as h base vs. Mara+)

That's not a full base. Maybe he can take out the OM and a few eggs or tubes, and some idiot dretches, but he hardly can play cleanup like a mara near an weakly guarded human base. Mara kills all, but slower. Psawhelmarmournade kills one or two, quickly. (speaking of individuals, not groups).

[Kiwi]

Would it *Freeze* the reactor?

[Conzul]

Would it *Freeze* the reactor?

NO, I'm  thinking just rets, teslas, and maybe the medistation or armory. But possibly just  and 

[ACKMAN]

That's not a full base. Maybe he can take out the OM and a few eggs or tubes, and some idiot dretches, but he hardly can play cleanup like a mara near an weakly guarded human base. Mara kills all, but slower. Psawhelmarmournade kills one or two, quickly. (speaking of individuals, not groups).

And the fact of base blowing up because they have no creep nearby doesn't help at all to kill the whole base.

Also, if a human succesfully painsawrushes humans will likely end the work. Same if a mara gets half hbase down.

AND... lcannon rushes can't, indeed, kill an alien base alone.

[Meisseli]

Humans rarely can take out a full alien base by one human, unlike marauder zap.

If you really have a base bad enough to be destroyed by one marauder or that horrible human defenders you deserve to lose.

Humans rarely can take out a full alien base by one human, unlike marauder zap.

*cough*
psaw + helmet + larmour + nade = fairly ded alien base if not built properly(same as h base vs. Mara+)

That's not a full base. Maybe he can take out the OM and a few eggs or tubes, and some idiot dretches, but he hardly can play cleanup like a mara near an weakly guarded human base. Mara kills all, but slower. Psawhelmarmournade kills one or two, quickly. (speaking of individuals, not groups).

Sounds like you just don't know how to psaw the alien base. Or even better, a weakly guarded alien base can be taken with pulse, lasgun, etc...

Your imagined situation of newbie humans not having the ability to hit a mara in your base is simply a situation you really don't want to aid the stupid humans. Imagine dretches not being able to bite you. That's the reverse; and in that case the human can easily finish the alien base too. And both are really all right.

P.S. Try your massdriver against marauder spam. Kills them really fast.

[Conzul]

Okay this is getting off track. Of course there are situational instances where a single human can destroy the alien base, but that's if it was unguarded and not built up. A marauder (or two) can wipe out a fully built human base with defenders. I don't have a problem with either of these facts. I just think that it would make rushing more fun and interesting for aliens when they are preceded by mara zaps that freeze. That way the aliens could have the choice of either hurting structs or humans, whereas now they have to kill the structs first in most cases.

[Meisseli]

Okay this is getting off track. Of course there are situational instances where a single human can destroy the alien base, but that's if it was unguarded and not built up. A marauder (or two) can wipe out a fully built human base with defenders. I don't have a problem with either of these facts. I just think that it would make rushing more fun and interesting for aliens when they are preceded by mara zaps that freeze. That way the aliens could have the choice of either hurting structs or humans, whereas now they have to kill the structs first in most cases.

And vice versa. Of course there are situational instances where a single alien can destroy the human base, but that's if it was unguarded and not built up.

Two marauders really cannot wipe out an entire base if one has brains. Grab your massdriver and shoot the aliens. You get one to two free shots before they even enter the base. After that it's a child's play. If they hop the RC, jetpack to on top of it and they can't even slash it. Or, shoot the RC hoppers with pulse. They really are screwed against pulse.

You can even build as a human. There are a dozen of bases to make marauders have a hard time.

[Conzul]

And vice versa. Of course there are situational instances where a single alien can destroy the human base, but that's if it was unguarded and not built up.

NO! Aliens can and often do take out fully guarded and built up bases, with limited numbers. All you need is one to distract and a mara or two to zap. I myself have zapped (by myself) a fully loaded human base to death in atcs with 10 per team. Everyone was shooting, no one was hitting. They also hit their own base, which aliens don't do often.

[F50]

I'd make a demo of taking out a decently built alien base with one life, but I'm too lazy.

[Conzul]

I'd make a demo of taking out a decently built alien base with one life, but I'm too lazy.

[A Spork]

And vice versa. Of course there are situational instances where a single alien can destroy the human base, but that's if it was unguarded and not built up.

NO! Aliens can and often do take out fully guarded and built up bases, with limited numbers. All you need is one to distract and a mara or two to zap. I myself have zapped (by myself) a fully loaded human base to death in atcs with 10 per team. Everyone was shooting, no one was hitting. They also hit their own base, which aliens don't do often.

1) ATCS is a crap example, as any base there is really easy Mara fodder.
2) any decently built h base should defend against mara attacks. They likely would do some damage, but not take out the entire base.
3) Obviously that human team sucked if there was 10 guys shooting at a Mara and no one hit it.
4) Would you mind sharing whatever mind-altering drug you seem to be on?

[Conzul]

1) ATCS is a crap example, as any base there is really easy Mara fodder.
2) any decently built h base should defend against mara attacks. They likely would do some damage, but not take out the entire base.
3) Obviously that human team sucked if there was 10 guys shooting at a Mara and no one hit it.
4) Would you mind sharing whatever mind-altering drug you seem to be on?

1.) Perhaps.
2.) True.
3.) No. They were distracted. It was the essence of teamwork.
4.) You've already had some, you're so far removed from the original idea. Changing mara zap to freeze doesn't weaken it.

[Meisseli]

And vice versa. Of course there are situational instances where a single alien can destroy the human base, but that's if it was unguarded and not built up.

NO! Aliens can and often do take out fully guarded and built up bases, with limited numbers. All you need is one to distract and a mara or two to zap. I myself have zapped (by myself) a fully loaded human base to death in atcs with 10 per team. Everyone was shooting, no one was hitting. They also hit their own base, which aliens don't do often.

Obviously those 10 humans deserve it.

ATCS


stand here (or place a building) to make maras unable to jump to your base from below


jump on top of the reactor if they are trying to get it down


build teslas (these two alone if near enough the ledge will kill the zappers)


a great camp spot once you see they are zap rushing

[UniqPhoeniX]

Depending on your base, standing on the ledge may make you the target of their zaps, and they may not even have to come in before the first rets are down from chained zap.

[Conzul]

Depending on your base, standing on the ledge may make you the target of their zaps, and they may not even have to come in before the first rets are down from chained zap.

Beat me to pointing that out, TY.

Also, bases like the one you picture rarely go up in atcs in practice, unless the alien team is very pathetic. I'm not sure how your point about how to make a perfect base in atcs has anything to do about mine where making chained zaps freeze would make for more interesting gameplay.