Are tyrants killing the game?

[se7ensnakes]

There is a series of problem with trem.  One is the Tyrant.  In an experienced well organize team the tyrant would be irrelevant.  But most of the trem games are mix-matched with experience and newbie players.  if there was a fast way of communicating when to rush, like teamspeak, that would be different.  but for now tyrants are like a tank and you only have machine guns.  In a melee the majority of players who confront a tyrant get killed fast.  The luci is atrocious  for team bleeding and and destroying your own base when defending.  if you get one experience tyrant you could hold down an entire game where all the humans could do is camp. and this camping games are boring.  They are also burky and when you use them you block other players.  Humans dont have this problem to such a degree.  But maybe the problem is not the tyrant at all.
The next problem is the ping and the hacks.  Lots of hacking.  I saw a tyrant rushing up a ramp and i was to the upper right.  I was ready to jump out of the way but midway up the ramp, when the tyrant was not facing me, had not even reached the top of the ramp and he killed me.  He did not even turn my way.  My first experience with an aimbotter I was a dretch.  No matter how i moved he will mass drive kill me.  even as i peaked he will immediately shoot me.  So he might have had somekind of wallhack.  No point in playing. 
There appears to be one server that is active.  this is the AA server.  The wrath server is good if you want practice but I have been stripped there and killing the base is too boring.  Running up and down to reload.  So essencially there is only one server and thats AA and sometimes there is no one there at all.  But maybe 1.1 is dying....I dont know.  All I am saying is that between the ping, hacks and underpowered humans the game is not as much fun. 

[42]

There is a series of problem with trem.  One is the Tyrant.  In an experienced well organize team the tyrant would be irrelevant.  But most of the trem games are mix-matched with experience and newbie players.  if there was a fast way of communicating when to rush, like teamspeak, that would be different.  but for now tyrants are like a tank and you only have machine guns.  In a melee the majority of players who confront a tyrant get killed fast.  The luci is atrocious  for team bleeding and and destroying your own base when defending.  if you get one experience tyrant you could hold down an entire game where all the humans could do is camp. and this camping games are boring.  They are also burky and when you use them you block other players.  Humans dont have this problem to such a degree.  But maybe the problem is not the tyrant at all.'

Actually, only the n00b players will be daunted by a rant.  If you have enough people (3, sometimes 2, or even 1) you can easily take down the rant by all firing at it, and dodging its charges (which is surprisingly easy in long hallways).  People have been known to take down a tyrant with nothing but a rifle (maneuvering a tank is hard).  As for the luci, it's bad for base def, but if used correctly, it is an amazing tool that will quickly decimate any rant or alien base. 

The next problem is the ping and the hacks.  Lots of hacking.  I saw a tyrant rushing up a ramp and i was to the upper right.  I was ready to jump out of the way but midway up the ramp, when the tyrant was not facing me, had not even reached the top of the ramp and he killed me.  He did not even turn my way.  My first experience with an aimbotter I was a dretch.  No matter how i moved he will mass drive kill me.  even as i peaked he will immediately shoot me.  So he might have had somekind of wallhack.  No point in playing. 

Do you know for certain he was using a crack?  I've been shot down quite a few times by a good mass-gunner.  They can be deadly accurate, even if you're moving very fast.  As for the rant, I'd only believe it if I saw the demo. If you could send it to us, I'd be more than happy to review it.

The other thing about crackers, is that they don't show up very often, and for a good reason: the kind of person who cheats of a game, quickly loses interest in it, because interest is fostered by skill and hard work, nor by cheating.  You don't get the same joy out of cheating than you do if you take down a lucisuit solo. 
 

There appears to be one server that is active.  this is the AA server.  The wrath server is good if you want practice but I have been stripped there and killing the base is too boring.  Running up and down to reload.  So essencially there is only one server and thats AA and sometimes there is no one there at all.  But maybe 1.1 is dying....I dont know.  All I am saying is that between the ping, hacks and underpowered humans the game is not as much fun. 

To the contrary, there are two servers active.  The US Official server always has a crowd, and R Unlimited CZ is also active much of the time.  They compose different styles of play; the official server is the vanilla game, while R Unlimited CZ has unlimited bp that delivers a unique twist. 

Since most of your arguments are void, and seem like the disgruntled musings of a beaten n00b, could you please provide some valid points next time?

[danmal]

Actually, only the n00b players will be daunted by a rant.  If you have enough people (3, sometimes 2, or even 1) you can easily take down the rant by all firing at it, and dodging its charges (which is surprisingly easy in long hallways).  People have been known to take down a tyrant with nothing but a rifle (maneuvering a tank is hard).  As for the luci, it's bad for base def, but if used correctly, it is an amazing tool that will quickly decimate any rant or alien base. 

That's not true at all. There's a reason rants are extremely popular both in public and organised matches. They're extremely tough, have high damage and a strong gap closer.

[Flux]

Stopped reading when you complained about the prevalence of "hacking"

[42]

Actually, only the n00b players will be daunted by a rant.  If you have enough people (3, sometimes 2, or even 1) you can easily take down the rant by all firing at it, and dodging its charges (which is surprisingly easy in long hallways).  People have been known to take down a tyrant with nothing but a rifle (maneuvering a tank is hard).  As for the luci, it's bad for base def, but if used correctly, it is an amazing tool that will quickly decimate any rant or alien base. 

That's not true at all. There's a reason rants are extremely popular both in public and organised matches. They're extremely tough, have high damage and a strong gap closer.

When I said that, I was talking about expert players with lasgun or higher.  This isn't the average player with a rifle that's gonna take a rant down all by his self.  (Really 1337 players, however...)

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

if the h team only uses things i can viably use mara or lower, i generally will.  if the h team fields stuff i feel i need a rant to counter, best believe i will be ranting it up.

regardless, from the tone of your post, you would definitely not like fighting my basi.

[Kaine]

Where is the "Like" button?!  I wish to like your post....

[AppleZ]

Kaine!!!
u still play???

[42]

Where is the "Like" button?!  I wish to like your post....

Whose post?

[se7ensnakes]

I dont see what you are saying...What i see is that for the most part humans camp.  Even if there are experience players on both sides.  Unless you get an experience player human and novice alien then the likely hood of camping is minimum.  I dont know where you people play but i only see mostly three servers.  I The only server that is active most of the time is the AA server.

[se7ensnakes]

In your gaming world everything is wonderful and as it should be.  Thats not what i see.  The reality is that most times the humans are camping.  Either they are camping or they are feeding.

[42]

You said that already.  And, no, humans don't camp.  As alien, you only ready see camping when there's a completely n00b team, since then only one or two people go out, and then they get killed off fast.  If you even have a few experienced players, they know to go out, and the inexperienced ones follow. 

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

You said that already.  And, no, humans don't camp.  As alien, you only ready see camping when there's a completely n00b team, since then only one or two people go out, and then they get killed off fast.  If you even have a few experienced players, they know to go out, and the inexperienced ones follow. 

and the inexperienced ones better run when they see the rant train coming.  i typically take on the bigger threat first, but others are just as quick to eat the naked.

[ULTRA Random ViruS]

In your gaming world everything is wonderful and as it should be.  Thats not what i see.  The reality is that most times the humans are camping.  Either they are camping or they are feeding.

That is majorly 1.1 only. Humans can't really camp in gpp because they have to drive the aliens out otherwise their base dies in like minutes due to adv maras and snipe explosions.
Also, the wrath newbie training server is not really a good place to train unless you actually live close to the server because it is lagged [meaning you have to aim ahead] and not to mension that the bots have hack-like aiming, which explains why the human bots have blasters and dont buy/evolve etc.
Also, before you accuse someone of hacking, you better spectate them, and see how accurate they are. If they are 100% accurate within a period of at least 10 seconds, then they're most likely are. I know people who has aiming abilities almost hack-like.

You said that already.  And, no, humans don't camp.  As alien, you only ready see camping when there's a completely n00b team, since then only one or two people go out, and then they get killed off fast.  If you even have a few experienced players, they know to go out, and the inexperienced ones follow. 

You do realise he is talking about 1.1? Most of your posts relate to gpp only. Also, if you ever played 1.1, tyrants are actual true tanks. They have 400 max hp, heal 14hp/s [they have 2x healing aura + 7 hp/s regeneration unlike gpp, 350 hp max and heals 3.5 hp/s [out of creep].

That should clear the confusion here.
For those who think tl;dr: 42 plays gpp, thinks and replies about gpp only, s27ensnakes plays 1.1 only, only knows about 1.1.

[se7ensnakes]

First you have to start out with one on one and then two on two.  I can easily take out a chainsuit as a goon. but that could go either way. I can never take out an experience or semi experience tyrant.  How long do you have to shoot with a chaingun, I think about 6 seconds.  How quickly can a tyrant kill a chainsuit, about one second.  The tyrant, of course, has the advantage up close, but really most of the maps there is nothing but corridors.  The humans camp until they either feed or get enough points to attack in groups using lucis or similar.  The game is the same most of the time.
There are hacks out there that you can bound-pounce, your kill radius is larger, your aiming box is larger, you could see thru walls, and now where the enemy is. Some people call these hackers pro......and some call them cheats.  What does the game trem is really like without hacks?  I dont know...

[42]

In your gaming world everything is wonderful and as it should be.  Thats not what i see.  The reality is that most times the humans are camping.  Either they are camping or they are feeding.

That is majorly 1.1 only. Humans can't really camp in gpp because they have to drive the aliens out otherwise their base dies in like minutes due to adv maras and snipe explosions.
Also, the wrath newbie training server is not really a good place to train unless you actually live close to the server because it is lagged [meaning you have to aim ahead] and not to mension that the bots have hack-like aiming, which explains why the human bots have blasters and dont buy/evolve etc.
Also, before you accuse someone of hacking, you better spectate them, and see how accurate they are. If they are 100% accurate within a period of at least 10 seconds, then they're most likely are. I know people who has aiming abilities almost hack-like.

You said that already.  And, no, humans don't camp.  As alien, you only ready see camping when there's a completely n00b team, since then only one or two people go out, and then they get killed off fast.  If you even have a few experienced players, they know to go out, and the inexperienced ones follow. 

You do realise he is talking about 1.1? Most of your posts relate to gpp only. Also, if you ever played 1.1, tyrants are actual true tanks. They have 400 max hp, heal 14hp/s [they have 2x healing aura + 7 hp/s regeneration unlike gpp, 350 hp max and heals 3.5 hp/s [out of creep].

That should clear the confusion here.
For those who think tl;dr: 42 plays gpp, thinks and replies about gpp only, s27ensnakes plays 1.1 only, only knows about 1.1.

Ah, thanks.  That's makes a whole lot more sense. 

[janev]

I think inactivity and real life concerns have done more to kill tremulous than tyrants.

1.1 Tyrants were strong in stage 3, humans were strong in stage 2 ---> tactics evolved and people had to know when to push their advantage. Or camp
1.2 Alien team is gimped to require teamwork and the use of special abilities ---> In theory use more teamwork, in practice people lost interest in the time it took to balance this new form of gameplay. And gameplay preferences forked the community.

Aaah for the good old days when the only thing you had to figure out was if you wanted to play with lagged vs unlagged, limited vs unlimited BP, SD on or OFF, share on or share off and so on. Now you have to decide between all those forked settings and GPP. No wonder there is nobody on the euro server. 

Have a nice day!

[se7ensnakes]

Actually I should have titled this  as:  Are hacks killing the game.  Try funlily and see how easy the game becomes. 

[Qrntz]

Actually I should have titled this  as:  Are hacks killing the game.  Try funlily and see how easy the game becomes. 

You're funny.

[ULTRA Random ViruS]

Actually I should have titled this  as:  Are hacks killing the game.  Try funlily and see how easy the game becomes. 

You could say that, but i haven't seen a real 1.1 hacker for about a year or so. As for gpp, there are hacks for it, some douchebag was advertising it on youtube... but i still dont see any active/common players that use it.

First you have to start out with one on one and then two on two.  [1]I can easily take out a chainsuit as a goon. but that could go either way. [2]I can never take out an experience or semi experience tyrant.  [5]How long do you have to shoot with a chaingun, I think about 6 seconds.  [4]How quickly can a tyrant kill a chainsuit, about one second.  The tyrant, of course, has the advantage up close, but really most of the maps there is nothing but corridors.  [5]The humans camp until they either feed or get enough points to attack in groups using lucis or similar.  The game is the same most of the time.
[6]There are hacks out there that you can bound-pounce, [7]your kill radius is larger, your aiming box is larger, you could see thru walls, and now where the enemy is. [8]Some people call these hackers pro......and some call them cheats.  [9]What does the game trem is really like without hacks?  I dont know...

[1].1.1: That depends on your aiming skills and the dodging skills of the chainsuit. Its just the matter of how long it takes you to constantly swipe him. Its actually easy if he doesn't use the sprint key.
gpp: Bsuits taller, pounce stronger, swipe repeat is longer and range is lower... effectively its easier to use pounce, and its quiet easy as long as you hit (duh)
[2]Its easier if you have unlagged on the server, you could lets say use luci and 'walk into the tyrant' if your/rant's ping is high enough [about 250+each] and do a 180 spin and shoot. It'll confuse the tyrant. It only works if the tyrant is moving your way.
[3] I'd say about 5 seconds.
[4] 1.1: about 2 seconds
gpp: less than one second (charge is OP for those who have low ping, for the high pingers it only applies if you corner them)
[5] In gpp that will bring you to lose due to the fact of 'build recovery timers' which take up like 8 seconds to recover 1 bp. I reckon a decent value is 4, but thats what they like so erm.]
[6] Never heard of this, but it is possible if you import the code from pbot codes.
[7] Impossible, you need the server to change its game.qvm to do so. It is not client-side. If you do edit your own, the chances are that you'll be kicked from a pure server from having invalid files or having the swipes not hit half the time.
[8] You need to spec them, they need to spec them. Then decide.
[9] Use a time machine and go to the year 2006, then play. I'm not sure if the majority of servers had unlagged at the time though, i never knew about it at the time.

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

\
gpp: less than one second (charge is OP for those who have low ping, for the high pingers it only applies if you corner them)

just learn the bullshit movement exploits that prevent you from taking most, if any, charge damage.

[UniqPhoeniX]

\
gpp: less than one second (charge is OP for those who have low ping, for the high pingers it only applies if you corner them)

just learn the bullshit movement exploits that prevent you from taking most, if any, charge damage.

So we counter balance bullshit with more bullshit now?

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

\
gpp: less than one second (charge is OP for those who have low ping, for the high pingers it only applies if you corner them)

just learn the bullshit movement exploits that prevent you from taking most, if any, charge damage.

So we counter balance bullshit with more bullshit now?

isnt that the way it has always been done? 

ive griped about the human bullshit movement exploits for some time now.

anyway, you shouild know i was being sarcastic.  you should know i dont want virus to learn the bullshit because then i would be less one feeder keeping me ranted the fuck up.

[ULTRA Random ViruS]

I know about the jumping thing. It doesn't work if the human is cornered though.
My feeding rate depends greatly on the map and the opponent's team ability to aim. No duh. I also just like the feeling of running in and headbiting once or twice for nothing.

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

I know about the jumping thing. It doesn't work if the human is cornered though.
My feeding rate depends greatly on the map and the opponent's team ability to aim. No duh. I also just like the feeling of running in and headbiting once or twice for nothing.

sure it works, depending on the map and just how cornered the human is.

and you DO know who you are talking to, right?  im the goddamn king of suicide dretch.

[ULTRA Random ViruS]

Maybe its my ping, everything's glitched. I've been realising lately that if i shoot (with unlagged) using md about half a dretch behind the dretch, i hit. If i shoot its head if its moving sideways with hea facing movement direction, i miss. I tested this on a fairely open map.
There is a big difference between 100 and 200 ping you know, and so is 200 to 300. From 200+ping, charge never works unless the human is not moving because i end up going through them or they go through me client-side and therefore my unlagged sees that i miss. From 100-200, charge actually is pretty OP. Below 120, you don't even need unlagged, i've actually turned it off for about three games on SiR server while doing a 1v2 againts two europeans with around 280 ping [probably brother/sisters or mates]. I played both teams. Guess who won. Me, 2-1, i lost one of them because i went to pack the dishes because my mum pretty much rules our house and by the time i got back, there was only a node left.
Sadly i wont turn it off again on that server because somehow my ping is fixed to 190+ which is almost unplayable for lagged.

[Nux]

stuff

Take a look here.

All I can say on the matter is the 'aiming behind target and hitting' effect is pronounced and real to me, but not to everyone. I can't be sure why other people I have asked haven't noticed it but am inclined to believe this is because when it does happen, people assume it was thier failing and not the failing of the rollback logic. I've noticed a similar problem with melee attacks when aiming in the same direction as you and the enemy are moving (so missing should be out of the question), if you are too close your slash will go beyond them and miss but when you're slightly further away the same attack will hit.

Another notable frustration I have with tremulous at higher pings (100+) is with collision detection. Yet again I can't be certain that it isn't just the fault of slow feedback (unavoidable with higher latency) but it seems as though beyond having less time to react to collisions, the collisions last for longer and any prepared counter movements are ignored; making the merest touch with an enemy or ally disastrous to your escape.

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

 the collisions last for longer and any prepared counter movements are ignored; making the merest touch with an enemy or ally disastrous to your escape.

is it like a lagspike when you are moving?  you "bounce" out of the collision in a seemingly random direction and velocity?

anyway, this right here is jusrt talk about how unlagged only gived you the illusion of doing what it is supposed to.  and it complicates things by showing things where they are not.

master your lag, learn where to aim for your ping, and you can pull off all the irritating bullshit like headchomps from a mile away and MDing dretches "through walls".

[/dev/humancontroller]

lagged

WRONG.

Take a look here.

i've just added some nitpicky comments there.

anyway, this right here is jusrt talk about how unlagged only gived you the illusion of doing what it is supposed to.  and it complicates things by showing things where they are not.

WRONG. unlagged does not influence drawing locations.

[RAKninja-Decepticon]

WRONG. unlagged does not influence drawing locations.

suddenly sold on that on account of me not giving a fuck.