New Map: the bunker

[theRifle]

In the past weeks I have built a map and i think now it is time to show it to others to get some feedback.

The map is missing some details (for example: rooms are light up, but there are no lamps around, ...)

You may download the map here:
http://upload2.net/page/download/XCDEqxKgYJHWgkY/map-theBunker-1.0.0.pk3.html

And here some screenshots:












Any feedback is welcome!

[Ksempac]

Ok, i checked your map. I think its pretty good.

The only thing i really didn t like, was the room on top of the default bases with only 3 crates...I know its a beta but right now, it seems as if you didnt know what to do with this space. I didn t like the crate room either because i think crates are what people use when they dont have any imagination, but still it was better than the empty space

Another thing : the vent is a bit too long and has too many turns...Turns are necessary to avoid humans who snip from far away and block the vents, but here we may find the contrary : a dretch camping in the vent in a corner during S1, waiting for a unarmored human to get in. Moreover i think its a bit too long to be really useful during the game.

On a side note, i couldn t prevent myself from shooting in the darts game... XD

[theRifle]

Ok, i checked your map. I think its pretty good.

Thanks  

only 3 Crates

Well ... originally i wanted to place surveillance monitors there (showing live-pictures of other parts of the map using target_camera - well, it worked, but it behaved like a mirror, not like a monitor ... so I removed it! (I know ... I should have tested this before in a test map  :-? )  
Probably I'll place some sort of tanks, tubes and machinery  there instead.

Crate Room

This is explicitly intended to be a storage room with crates

the vent is a bit too long and has too many turns

Ok, this is true - especially the argument with the camping dretch in S1.
I will remove some turns.

[Taiyo.uk]

Just downloaded... I like it!

But I've got a load of complaints as usual :wink:

-The static sound from the television can be heard all over the place. Perhaps reduce the radius of the sound source (is that possible in Q3?)

-It feels a little... Isolated I guess, as if it really is a bunker in the void. Some fake (unopenable) doors or barricaded corridors could make the bunker feel like a part of a larger complex.

-Some areas feel minimalist, e.g. many showers have a profile strip in the floor-wall corners. Including this in the sowers/infirmary will give a much greater visual weight and break the discontinuity between the wall and floor textures.

-There's some z-fighting here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/10974774@N00/306054626/

-It's the first bunker I've seen with real wood flooring

Nice work!

[DASPRiD]

-It's the first bunker I've seen with real wood flooring

Nice work!

Never saw a german bunker for Adolf Hitler? ;>

[theRifle]

Just downloaded... I like it!

 

But I've got a load of complaints as usual

I've released it to get complaints, hints, ... :-)

-The static sound from the television can be heard all over the place. Perhaps reduce the radius of the sound source (is that possible in Q3?)

I know
Unfortunately i don't know how to limit sound propagation (there is no radius or whatever u can assign to a sound source.) Only one flag - 'global' - which means, that u can hear the sound in the whole map: this is turned off!) If anyone has a solution for this problem, I would be very thankfully. (I asked about how to limit sound propagation a few days ago in this forum. I removed the '-fast' switch from the VIS stage, placed a hint brush ... no change ... sound can be heared from far a away)
If I can't find a solution, i think, I will remove sound.

-It feels a little... Isolated I guess, as if it really is a bunker in the void. Some fake (unopenable) doors or barricaded corridors could make the bunker feel like a part of a larger complex.

Ok - nice point of view. I have an idea already, where and how I will implement that.

-Some areas feel minimalist, ...

You are right! But i wanted to release a version now, to get feedback about my work in a medium stage. So I am able to do changes on the layout more easily, if it would be neccessary. It would be nice, if some server admins could host my map - to get some feedback about playability of the map (If doors are too small, map unbalanced, etc...)

z-fighting

Fuck! Thanks a lot! I was very careful to avoid z-Fighting ... this one I didn't recognize.

-It's the first bunker I've seen with real wood flooring  

concrete, metal are in every map ... NOW we have a comfortable place for camping humans  ... even with beds and lockers

Thank you for your helpful answer!

[Kaleo]

I'm liking this

[poto killer]

this map is.....  AWSOME

[Ksempac]

This is explicitly intended to be a storage room with crates

I know. However, we often see storage area in maps (regardless of the game...from Doom to Half-life 2). Tremor or Gamma Core are good examples of this. That's because it is easy to make a big room and fill it with crates. That's why storage room are often considered as a "filler" for maps. No offence intended

About your monitor : Did you check Pulse's monitors ? they can get you a headache but they work fine. Another possibility is to put the monitor and blur them like the TV. You could say the alien invasion created an electrical problem and now all the monitors and TV are out of order. You could even break the machinery in the alien base to show why monitors arent working.

Because i don't think a tank or even machinery in a room upstairs, between bedroom and showers would look realistic

[cp blast]

this map is great, nice work

[RedGuff]

Hello.
I looked as a spectator mode, then I tested to “0 against 1”, in Alien and Human, mode “devmap”. The two bases appeared very vulnerable to me. I did not find a place where to move the bases.
On the other hand, the aesthetic aspect of this map of small size is excellent.
Thanks for this new map.

[theRifle]

Well ... this map should have no "camp-forever" place :-)
Therefore each room has at least 2 entrances. Think about other maps: for example camping humans in Ele room on karith station using Luci spam to prevent Aliens from coming in. Probably by now it is slightly unfair for the Alien team - I think, I've to build some places where Eggs can be hidden.

[[db@]Megabite]

Heya,

I just had a look at the map and there are some things I would like to mention. No complaints, just my thoughts.

Pros:

- clean work with an eye on performance.

- more colorful than most other maps.

Cons (apart from above-mentioned):

- Scale. Especially the living area is badly scaled in my eyes. The bathroom looks like a normal bathroom except the pissoirs are made for smurfs, the player running around in it smurf-sized. The cantina is alike, some stairs and most ceiling-heigths and doors as well.

- General blandness. You basically built a lego-house and started adding details in spots while other stuff is left too basic. Most annoying were the doors all missing frames and being strangely textured "inside" where the frame should be.

- Believability. I understand it should be a bunker but it is missing the feeling of a bunker. You should take a look at some reallife bunker photos or at other games like quake2/4, doom3, wolfenstein featuring bunkers or bunker-like buildings. Take screenshot and rebuild some stuff you see there... pipes, inventory, technical stuff. Big bunkers also have homelike living quarters but I guess very few have parquet flooring...

- No clear version-tagging. Is it alpha, is it beta? The lack of any tags tells anybody reviewing it that it is meant as a final release which is it clearly not. Releasing further versions with the same name for pk3/bsp may drive people into version errors when the server is running a different version than the player. Call the next release thebunker_b2.bsp or such.

That are the main points I would mention. Another small thing is the polished railing. You made a nice shader for it with a dretch running around as a reflection. Well, I like it, it even brought a grin to my face...
but I think it will get annoying fast. There is no real dretch, just a reflection and the movement is quite disturbing on the long turn when you know there is most likely nothing moving in the room. It just pushes the believability-point even further so I would like the animation removed for the final version.

Danny

[Taiyo.uk]

Megabite"]That are the main points I would mention. Another small thing is the polished railing. You made a nice shader for it with a dretch running around as a reflection. Well, I like it, it even brought a grin to my face...

Reminds me of UTCS  :wink:

[[db@]Megabite]

Never noticed it there...  :eek:

Danny

[theRifle]

First thanks for your reply.

Scale

I know, scale is a problem now. Definitely. I have to change room-hight in the living areas to get it more believable - but i think, I can't make it 100 percent realistic, if it should be playable in Tremulous (doors will get too small for tyrants, ...)
The problem is the roomheight I think - its by now over 200 (this is a 'real' room-hight of about 6 or 7 metres). I have to shrink that.

pissoirs: if i move them up, they would be in height of the players face :O
(Players have a hitbox with heigt 56 - top edge of pissoir is at 52.

too basic

Yes, by now. So I am able to do changes on layout more easily. If there are a lot of Details, it is much more work to change roomdesign. This is very handy now, as I have to redesign the living area

(And of course: creating all the details is a *lot* of work. This will take a few weeks, as I have to do other things as well. So be please be patient. I will add pipes, inventory, technical stuff - but it will take some time.

Door frames

Hm - i did it that way, as i wanted to have an easy location-hint for players which are new to the map:
blue: near human base
yellow: neutral
red: near alien base
Not sure, if i want change this ... i'll wait for some more replies.

parquet flooring

Hmmm ... ok ... probably I will change the floor texture.

No clear version-tagging

 :oops:  ... My fault. Never do critical work, if u are too tired.

polished railing

I just copied the shader of UTCS and changed nothing
(In the next release there will be a credits-file. I forgot to add it in this release).

There is a lot of work to do, until I can say that it is finished

[whitebear]

this map favours humans due ammount of paths without opening doors.

[smallyellowbug]

this map favours humans due ammount of paths without opening doors.

Don't have to wait for door opening -> Can chomp humans quicker.
So the fact that there are no doors actually favours aliens  

btw, I also like your map!

[techhead]

Actually, different door types favor different sides.

Doors that open quickly favor melee range attacks.
Doors that open slowly favor ranged attacks.
Doors that stay open longer favor staying still (Humans, Adv, Dragoon).
Doors that close quicker favor moving through the door.

A lack of door favors shooting ranged attacks down an empty corridor.

[KnightBear]

Now place a trigger_multiple on each side of the door. On the trigger that exists in the outdoor part of the level....

If you want to simply add music to an MP map. add key: music value: path/to/mp3. (ex: music/t2_rancor/rancor_action.mp3) that is the correct pathing to the music files we used in JA.




Written by: Justin 'Jesterspaz' Negrete

this is a tut on how to keep your music in.  i havent tried it yet, but it makes sense.

i got this at map-craft.com.  its a pretty handy site for tutorials in Radiant, though the specialize in Jedi academy.  radiant works the same for both, its a matter reference.

[Kaleo]

I love it!!!

The only problem is that, in the box room, the wooden boxes are all identical. Can somthing be done about this? Mabey just use a box texture rather than a box + blood texture.



And the poster of the woman should be |\||_||)3!!1!!! (nude)

[KnightBear]

lol @ leet speak.

[theRifle]

Thanks a lot  for your replies so far, especially the one about sound. Will try this asap.
Have a lot to do in the moment and my time for mapping is limited

Next steps will be:

- fill the upper floor areas in human/alien base with inventory.

- reduce the room-size in the living area.

- redesigned the entrances to the first-aid room (almost done)

- creating details ...

[Janis]

cant download this map don't see any link!

[Taiyo.uk]

*sigh*

Look at the very first post in this thread.

[n00b pl0x]

woah who would have thought its in the first post!