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Author Topic: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.  (Read 22786 times)

v0rt3x

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id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« on: May 16, 2008, 05:48:03 pm »
John Carmack said that he'd release the doom 3 engine, to quote him: 'the doom 3 stuff will be open source.'.
I just wondered if the tremulous devs are planning to do anything with it. Seeing as this is is a standalone quake 3 mod,
I'm wondering if it could become a standalone quake 4/doom3 mod.
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Odin

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2008, 06:04:01 pm »
Did he say a date? Where did you get this info?
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Sentinel

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2008, 06:08:02 pm »
Yes, and then stay in Tremulous from 100% active players only 10%, due to high hardware demands. Fun is not about supreme graphic, but about bug fixes, new features and originality. That is my opinion.
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Odin

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2008, 06:09:14 pm »
Doom3 can be played on anything recent, really. It set the standard for the time, and now anything from 2003 with a decent video card can run it at its max FPS setting(60).
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Lakitu7

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2008, 06:21:58 pm »
Most people in Trem complain that they can't run Transit. Ergo, most of our players do not have "anything from 2003 with a decent video card." :(

Of course that somewhat implies I would support an engine change otherwise, which isn't the case.
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David

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2008, 06:29:12 pm »
When you break it down to pros and cons, the cons column gets full nice and quick, the pros contains 'shiney' and not much more.  And 90% of the cons negate that anyway.
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NiTRoX

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2008, 07:08:36 pm »
Quote from: Odin on May 16, 2008, 06:04:01 pm
Did he say a date? Where did you get this info?

You want to make a date with Carmack? (:

Anyways, we do we need to port Trem to Doom3 Engine again?
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Taiyo.uk

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2008, 07:09:14 pm »
I don't think the system requirements of id tech 4 are a major issue. The reason being that if trem moves to Id tech 4, the development time will be huge as the trem code will need to be rewritten and most of the content will need major work. The majority of players would be able to run trem on id tech 4 when it's ready, just like the majority could run the current trem on id tech 3 when it was released.
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v0rt3x

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2008, 07:14:57 pm »
Carmack *never* and I mean *never* commits to a date. his one liner for dates is: 'when it's ready.' good old Carmack :p
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Taiyo.uk

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2008, 07:27:12 pm »
With a large, currently commercially licensed codebase like id tech 4, committing to a source release date would be rather... stupid. Closed -> open transitions of that scale are seldom simple enough for people plan a release date.
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Lava Croft

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2008, 09:53:58 pm »
Like most id Tech, every generation lasts for about 6 years, which means we can expect an open source release of id Tech 4 around the year 2010.
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gareth

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2008, 09:59:48 pm »
should be right on time for 1.2
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Lava Croft

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2008, 10:02:52 pm »
Quote from: gareth on May 16, 2008, 09:59:48 pm
should be right on time for 1.2
If the Devs did not have to redo every piece of art and code, yes.

I want to add that DOOM3 was released in 2004, and requires quite a hefty computer to run properly at 60fps.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2008, 01:41:32 am by Lava Croft »
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Paradox

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #13 on: May 17, 2008, 04:01:53 am »
The specs are a bit out of there for tremulous.

But man, would i love to get my hands on the UI creation program. No more crappy texture buttons. Hello dynamic controls.
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Kaleo

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #14 on: May 17, 2008, 06:45:04 am »
I wouldn't expect to see Tremulous ported to idTech4 anytime soon... The devs seem to have more than just Tremulous on their minds. If they didn't, 1.2 would probably be out by now.

Urban Terror, on the other hand, would probably make the change in a matter of months. They're all like "Ooh, look at us... We've released a patch in less than a year. Nyuh nyuh nyhu."
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doomagent13

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2008, 04:01:49 am »
I dont know if it would be easy or even possible, but what about having both id Tech 3 and id Tech 4 based clients...
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David

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2008, 11:37:33 am »
I'm going to assume they use different protocols for everything.
It would also cause issue with pure checks etc, both clients needing all the blurb for both.
It would basically be moving the render from 4 to 3, which is probably a total rewrite...
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jal

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #17 on: May 19, 2008, 08:38:26 am »
Quote from: Lakitu7 on May 16, 2008, 06:21:58 pm
Most people in Trem complain that they can't run Transit. Ergo, most of our players do not have "anything from 2003 with a decent video card." :(

Of course that somewhat implies I would support an engine change otherwise, which isn't the case.

A full Transit game has higher CPU requirements than doom3 singleplayer mission maps.

In any case, the main issue is that doom3 engine isn't done for online multiplayer gaming, which is what Trem is. If they released the Q4 src it would be an easier port, but if the base is doom3 it would double the (already very big) porting work.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2008, 08:43:16 am by jal »
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Kaleo

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #18 on: May 19, 2008, 10:32:07 am »
I'm assuming that it will be the Q4 source, not the D3 one. Carmack himself agrees that Q4 is a much better job of the source, and I can't see him shitting in the faces of Open Source devs like Darklegion...
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Odin

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #19 on: May 19, 2008, 05:52:04 pm »
In my opinion most of the problems with the engine will be fixed within months, just like Quake 3 had. ioQuake3 includes many improvements to the renderer/client stuff and server stuff that makes it run much faster in general.
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Lava Croft

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2008, 06:50:21 pm »
Quote from: Odin on May 19, 2008, 05:52:04 pm
ioQuake3 includes many improvements to the renderer/client stuff and server stuff that makes it run much faster in general.
ioQuake3 does not have many renderer improvements. The only renderer improvement I know of is something related to particle rendering, as I was told. And the statement that it runs faster than Q3 1.32 is questionable at best.
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Odin

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2008, 07:38:33 pm »
Quote from: Lava Croft on May 19, 2008, 06:50:21 pm
Quote from: Odin on May 19, 2008, 05:52:04 pm
ioQuake3 includes many improvements to the renderer/client stuff and server stuff that makes it run much faster in general.
ioQuake3 does not have many renderer improvements. The only renderer improvement I know of is something related to particle rendering, as I was told. And the statement that it runs faster than Q3 1.32 is questionable at best.
I recall Timbo stating that the renderer has been cleaned up and optimized for speed.
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jal

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2008, 09:37:03 am »
Quote from: Kaleo on May 19, 2008, 10:32:07 am
I'm assuming that it will be the Q4 source, not the D3 one. Carmack himself agrees that Q4 is a much better job of the source, and I can't see him shitting in the faces of Open Source devs like Darklegion...
Maybe, but the same thing could be said about the RTCW engine, or its ET version, and it wasn't the one open sourced. Why? Because part of the intellectual property belongs to Raven, and Raven doesn't have this open source tradition.
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Kaleo

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #23 on: May 22, 2008, 11:17:08 am »
It's the source. I'm fairly sure that id would own the rights to the source outright. Wouldn't it just be the game media (gfx, models, sounds etc.) that would be problematic to be released for free.
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jal

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #24 on: May 22, 2008, 03:46:44 pm »
Nope. We are not talking about Raven working over a GPL'ed source here. The rules we usually apply to games like Tremulous don't apply. Quake4 was made in exactly the same maner RTCW was made. This is, a game which is IP of ID is developed by Raven using a licensed ID engine. The engine wasn't under GPL, so the changes made by Raven are IP of Raven.
I'm not saying ID can't ask Raven for the permission and just get it for free. I guess if they ask for it, they may very well get it, but past experiences show ID chose to release under GPL their homemade games only. I also suppose that if they can ask Raven for Q4, they could also as Splashdamage for ET:QW, it's just the same situation and an even more evolutioned version of the engine ;)
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Lava Croft

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Re: id tech 4/doom 3 source code release.
« Reply #25 on: May 22, 2008, 04:32:39 pm »
I think Raven is not even allowed to open source their additions to the id Tech code. I'm fairly certain they are bound by a license of some kind, that prevents them from open sourcing licensed id technology.
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