Author Topic: Gameplay Preview Phase 1 Results (Read 197898 times)

Silver · « **Reply #60 on:** December 20, 2009, 09:49:00 pm »

Quote from: Z+ SM p(EEn- on December 20, 2009, 09:34:42 pm

Quote from: Silver on December 20, 2009, 07:29:23 am
Quote from: David on December 19, 2009, 11:20:52 pm
Obviously not all players are retarded, but the vast majority of the feedback is.

People saying that X should be changed is mostly useless, because there is someone else saying the exact opposite. The cause, reasoning, and the why are never properly explained. People never flesh out their ideas, so the useful bits aren't there. Someone saying that there should be a 1 evo class with 10000hp and a nuke is stupid, so gets ignored. If they were to say why they want it, how they think it would help, then people might realise that lots of the suggestions stem from the same perceived problem, and so be able to investigate it. (Also 90% of suggestions could have been avoided if the poster stopped to think about the repercussions for 20 seconds.)

If people think playing S3 as humans is boring then they should say it. Asking for a BFG9k1 isn't going to fix it or help anything, and isn't useful feedback. Saying why they want it would be.

Also I know I'm not a game designer, trying to get into game development was probably the most stupid thing I ever did. Still you all spout stupid and pointless crap at times, so I get to make stupid incoherent rants too.

No one here has been asking for the stupid shit you just said. In fact we've been complaining more about the changes we DON'T like not the changes we want to see. Most of us are perfectly content with 1.1 and would rather see 1.2 change more on the graphics/maps/interface/dev support/site(client) updates(on main page for the new players to download) than balance and gameplay changes. All I see in 1.2 dev's randomly guess checking nerfs and super power ups to classes that didn't need to be touched in the first place.
No one here has been asking for the stupid shit you just said. Or most of anything else on this forum. Therefore, you shouldn't have said that because nobody asked you too. And you too, DavidSev. And most everything else on this forum.

Are you seriously saying that no one has asked what I asked for?

Everyone has been asking/drooling over stanumn's new models.

EVERYONE has constantly been asking for an updated client on the main page, at least tjw's for god sakes. Hell I'd be content with MG's but I'd like to see tremfusions the most.

Look at all the people sporting the long live the granger signatures? That's proof right there of people being upset with the changes made, like the removal of the hovel.

Think before you post maybe?

UniqPhoeniX · « **Reply #61 on:** December 20, 2009, 10:38:56 pm »

The granger sig is exactly that: asking for something without explanation. Tesla was needed because humans only had 1 other defence. Hovel was similar enough to a barri to be called a (now inferior) duplicate. For those saying it's free, how about you use 10 of the extra bps aliens got, for another barri (since now almost all bases use a barri)?
And Stannums models will be coming anyway, they are not ready yet. Same for maps, HUD & menus, you can make those yourself too. It's called GPP = Gameplay preview, and coders don't usually make good modellers. TJW client is old already, tho yes MG should have gotten onto tremulous.net.

your face · « **Reply #62 on:** December 20, 2009, 11:05:56 pm »

Explanation: it was awesome.

There.

phungus420 · « **Reply #63 on:** December 21, 2009, 02:46:15 am »

Quote from: UniqPhoeniX on December 20, 2009, 10:38:56 pm

For those saying it's free, how about you use 10 of the extra bps aliens got, for another barri (since now almost all bases use a barri)?

The number of BP is going to be server dependent. The dev's decision to add 10BP in the GPP is irrelevant to the game balance once it goes public. Just like the most popular servers will allow rebuilding of the armory, medi, OM, RC, and booster in SD, as they do now. My point with the SD thing is more that the pro goon insta win is skewing the results on game balance. Also I'd be curious about how many games result in an alien win due to deconing, which is far more devastating to humans then aliens.

mooseberry · « **Reply #64 on:** December 21, 2009, 06:20:12 am »

Quote from: Silver on December 20, 2009, 09:49:00 pm

Look at all the people sporting the long live the granger signatures? That's proof right there of people being upset with the changes made, like the removal of the hovel.

Oh yeah, because a few of your friends have signatures about grangers....

David · « **Reply #65 on:** December 21, 2009, 08:17:21 am »

1.2 is a different game, it doesn't have rebuild-able armouries. Live with it.

BriareoS · « **Reply #66 on:** December 21, 2009, 10:45:35 am »

Hi, there is my feedback ( as euro long-time player ).
The game modifications are not bad at all and i don't miss holvels that mutch.
Btw there is 1 thing that i think is a bit ruining the game balance.
AdvGoon at s2.
I think this will make the game more campy, since as aliens can snipe the base humans has all the rights to stay in base to guard it.
Besides goon+ with ( now even more powerful ) basi+ have no such fear of s2 humans, and the great hs2 advantage is a now thiner.

Is there any chance to try some games ( for stats ) with goon+ back to s3?
If you don't want to bring up an official server, i can build a modded one by my own. In that case, are you intrested in stats?

phungus420 · « **Reply #67 on:** December 21, 2009, 09:14:27 pm »

Quote from: David on December 21, 2009, 08:17:21 am

1.2 is a different game, it doesn't have rebuild-able armouries. Live with it.

Neither does 1.1. But the community modded in the option, because having the arm/medi/booster along with OM/RC rebuildable makes sense, and is a more interesting game. And guess what, since the devs are taking a "We know best aproach" (to a community created mod

), the players will just have to do it again.

I don't have to live with anything. I have a couple options: I can not play 1.2 on release, I can mod the game to allow this feature, hell I could just stop playing tremulous. Telling me to "live with it" just shows you're a moron.

kevlarman · « **Reply #68 on:** December 21, 2009, 10:05:04 pm »

Quote from: phungus420 on December 21, 2009, 09:14:27 pm

Quote from: David on December 21, 2009, 08:17:21 am
1.2 is a different game, it doesn't have rebuild-able armouries. Live with it.

Neither does 1.1. But the community modded in the option, because having the arm/medi/booster along with OM/RC rebuildable makes sense, and is a more interesting game. And guess what, since the devs are taking a "We know best aproach" (to a community created mod ), the players will just have to do it again.

I don't have to live with anything. I have a couple options: I can not play 1.2 on release, I can mod the game to allow this feature, hell I could just stop playing tremulous. Telling me to "live with it" just shows you're a moron.

rebuildable armories made it rediculously easy to drag the game to the time limit every time, and that was before it got an hp boost.

FisherP · « **Reply #69 on:** December 26, 2009, 08:15:10 pm »

All this talk about rebuild-able armories and medi's and stuff makes me think that SD is designed for the alien win. Since all the aliens need to do is to take down the armory, sit back and let the humans wear themselves out. Then go in for the kill. The only way humans can counter that is with energy weapons. But then since they can't get them back if they die, they camp. I have to agree with the rebuild-able team here. There isn't often that the humans win in SD because it's geared for an alien win because of the non-rebuild-able armory, it's that simple. If humans could rebuild that stuff you will find that they will leave their bases a lot more.

David · « **Reply #70 on:** December 26, 2009, 09:04:06 pm »

It's totally human biased, all they have to do is go in and kill the OM, and then just soak up the dretches...

UniqPhoeniX · « **Reply #71 on:** December 27, 2009, 02:10:33 am »

Quote from: FisherP on December 26, 2009, 08:15:10 pm

If humans could rebuild that stuff you will find that they will leave their bases a lot more.

I disagree with this. Camping is only used because it delays the inevitable, by a lot. You can make the teams as unbalanced as you want, newbs/noobs will always camp for no reason, even in the stronger team. If you make camping not work (for example by having armory not rebuildable) then at least the games will not be delayed so much. Yes, some players will rush more, and if armory goes down, they camp until base is back to full strength. How is the game supposed to end?

Silver · « **Reply #72 on:** December 27, 2009, 03:00:16 am »

By coordinating a proper rush and taking out the telenodes instead?

UniqPhoeniX · « **Reply #73 on:** December 27, 2009, 06:46:57 am »

By the time you get all the nodes down, there would be almost nothing else left anyway, so rebuilding wouldn't make a difference in that case. The SD games end after something essential & non-rebuildable goes down. And I also think SD supports a good human team more then aliens. BTW the armory goes behind the reactor, not the other way around.

David · « **Reply #74 on:** December 27, 2009, 08:21:55 am »

Quote from: Silver on December 27, 2009, 03:00:16 am

By coordinating a proper rush and taking out the telenodes instead?

We obviously that wont work, because if it does work then the game would have ended 20 minutes ago.
The whole point of SD is a quick end.

Silver · « **Reply #75 on:** December 27, 2009, 07:59:35 pm »

Quote from: David on December 27, 2009, 08:21:55 am

Quote from: Silver on December 27, 2009, 03:00:16 am
By coordinating a proper rush and taking out the telenodes instead?

We obviously that wont work, because if it does work then the game would have ended 20 minutes ago.
The whole point of SD is a quick end.

No, because before SD, telenodes can be rebuilt. In SD, if you take out a telenode, not only does it slow down their spawn rate making it less crowded/easier to get the second one, it can't be rebuilt even in SD Mode 2. I've ended games a ton on AA as soon as SD hits by going for nodes or eggs. When the OM, Armory, Booster, Medi, and DC aren't re-buildable instead of just encouraging the game to end like SD does, it just makes it a cheap end. It's just forcing the game to end immediately probably to the team that didn't deserve to win. I like the idea of a progressive end, making it so those getting nodes/eggs actually have a positive effect towards the end of the game, instead of making it so if you lose one armory(which is the easiest human structure to snipe because of it's size) you can no longer rush efficiently because you're forced to be a rifle. I kind of liked the ESD Concept, but I feel it was poorly set up because of Regen on Tyrant and Tyrant in general verse Pulse Suits. It just didn't work. I think SD Mode 2 is efficient enough to get the job done without making too cheap of an ending or forcing it. Camping will always be part of this game, taking the armory out and making it unbuildable only encourages camping. A less steep learning curve would help people to rush, but unfortunately there will always people who prefer to sit in base.

kevlarman · « **Reply #76 on:** December 27, 2009, 08:14:03 pm »

allowing the armory to be rebuilt encourages even more camping (sd doesn't help much against a human base built to take advantage of unlimited barricades).

Asvarox · « **Reply #77 on:** December 27, 2009, 08:48:47 pm »

If you expose your arm to be destroyed in first few minutes of sd, then you certainly deserve to lose. Builders have to learn how to build 1.2 human bases, this includes correct arm placing

* Asvarox moves back to times where rebuildable things at sd were something exotic, building arm behind rc <3

MitSugna · « **Reply #78 on:** December 27, 2009, 09:29:55 pm »

what if someone kills the arm and disconnects?
!revert :/

KamikOzzy · « **Reply #79 on:** December 29, 2009, 11:12:15 am »

Quote from: kevlarman on December 27, 2009, 08:14:03 pm

allowing the armory to be rebuilt encourages even more camping (sd doesn't help much against a human base built to take advantage of unlimited barricades).

I don't think so. In the days when the arm couldn't be rebuilt, I remember people being paranoid as fuck about losing it, and there would always be a repairer stuck on it. I'm much more willing to make a rush if I feel confident I won't be helpless after I return, no? SD Mode 2 is one of the best updates we've had over the years.

Also, about this whole aliens-winning-more deal:

Are you guys testing with ff on yet? FF will surely be a part of any self-respecting server, and from my experience it has a much greater effect on the alien side of the game.

Norfenstein · « **Reply #80 on:** December 29, 2009, 12:52:48 pm »

Don't forget that the armoury has 140 more health than it did in 1.1, and in 1.1 an advanced goon could kill one at range in all of three seconds; now with its health increase and the barb repeat and regen increase, that's the biggest threat to the armoury taken away.

Quote from: KamikOzzy on December 29, 2009, 11:12:15 am

Are you guys testing with ff on yet? FF will surely be a part of any self-respecting server, and from my experience it has a much greater effect on the alien side of the game.

Ideally the game would be balanced with FF on or off, so we're going to finish balancing FF off first (to a satisfactory extent).

temple · « **Reply #81 on:** December 29, 2009, 07:56:04 pm »

Quote from: Norfenstein on December 29, 2009, 12:52:48 pm

Don't forget that the armoury has 140 more health than it did in 1.1, and in 1.1 an advanced goon could kill one at range in all of three seconds; now with its health increase and the barb repeat and regen increase, that's the biggest threat to the armoury taken away.

But this where I completely disagree.

How does it sit with alien players? What are they supposed to do? The more you improve humans, the harder you make it for aliens. As if it wasn't hard enough already.

In regards to goons killing the armory...so what? That is what goons and any alien should do. The problem isn't the armory, its the humans that let goons have the opportunity or comfort to launch those attacks. When humans sit in the base, goons get confident and start jumping into the base. You either kill the goons BEFORE they get close enough to hurt the base or damage them enough so that they won't risk a siege.

For each improvement aliens have received, they received a significant handicap. Basilisks and marauders are better, goons and rants are less so. Regen changes have definitely been a give and take, heavier on the take side of things. The alien base is better and weaker at the same time considering the removal of some structures; more and less damage from other defenses. Jesus, dretches can't even damage rets anymore. OMG DRETCHES WERE SO OVERPOWERED, THEY WERE KILLING THE BASE!

Humans....what have they lost in any of these changes? And seriously, were humans that broken in 1.1 that they needed improvements on top of alien nerfs?

mooseberry · « **Reply #82 on:** December 29, 2009, 11:08:34 pm »

Well... the stats seemed to think so.

temple · « **Reply #83 on:** December 30, 2009, 12:11:40 am »

Quote from: mooseberry on December 29, 2009, 11:08:34 pm

Well... the stats seemed to think so.

I honestly want to see Norf or anyone else balance the game so that the stats are even. Absurdity is all I have left.

AppleJuice · « **Reply #84 on:** December 30, 2009, 11:25:47 pm »

Quote from: temple on December 29, 2009, 07:56:04 pm

But this where I completely disagree.

How does it sit with alien players? What are they supposed to do? The more you improve humans, the harder you make it for aliens. As if it wasn't hard enough already.

In regards to goons killing the armory...so what? That is what goons and any alien should do. The problem isn't the armory, its the humans that let goons have the opportunity or comfort to launch those attacks. When humans sit in the base, goons get confident and start jumping into the base. You either kill the goons BEFORE they get close enough to hurt the base or damage them enough so that they won't risk a siege.

For each improvement aliens have received, they received a significant handicap. Basilisks and marauders are better, goons and rants are less so. Regen changes have definitely been a give and take, heavier on the take side of things. The alien base is better and weaker at the same time considering the removal of some structures; more and less damage from other defenses. Jesus, dretches can't even damage rets anymore. OMG DRETCHES WERE SO OVERPOWERED, THEY WERE KILLING THE BASE!

Humans....what have they lost in any of these changes? And seriously, were humans that broken in 1.1 that they needed improvements on top of alien nerfs?

Goons are better than their 1.1 counterparts (currently). Much better. Just pounce more often.

Tyrants - debatable. I can't comment much about them since I haven't used them too much (recently), but a good charger is very deadly. The rant's range/width should have been nerfed anyway, because in 1.1...it was ridiculous. In 1.2, there's no more being hit by a random noob slash that shouldn't have hit but somehow did.

Regen - I think this aspect is great, and I've played aliens more often than I've played humans. It injects a lot more strategy into Tremulous - forward eggs, healing/grabbing basilisks, less repeated camping around corners, etc..

Alien base - how exactly is it weaker? Hives do more damage, the bees are faster and the repeat is lower; trappers are pretty much the same; barricades are overall much more useful; acid tubes - not sure how to interpret the values in Tremulous.h, since the names are a little weird, but they feel pretty similar. You said structures were removed - what was removed other than the mostly useless hovel (marginally useful if you have a good builder, but most of the time it is not)?

Overall, I don't think aliens were really nerfed; some of them just require a change in tactics. (Emphasis on overall - I believe the goon chomp is slightly nerfed, while the goon pounce is pretty damn overpowered; in other words, minor aspects might have been nerfed, but overall, aliens were not)

temple · « **Reply #85 on:** December 31, 2009, 12:34:47 am »

Pounce is dumb and let me spell it out for you.

Pounce

hits 1 person.
is less effective at range.
is negated heavily by armor.
takes a long time to charge.

Chomping

Is faster (1.1)
Can do double damage for a head bite
Can hit multiple people(time wise vs pounce).
Scales against armor better (due to headchomps)

The only drawback to chomping is that it requires being close and a headshot to be deadly. But aiming a pounce is easier than aiming a headchomp. The only hard thing about pouncing is the delay and limitations of charging one. That's not a skill challenge, its a feature handicap. Its takes skill to headchomp. It doesn't take skill to hold and release a button.

The problem is that people have it in their heads that goons are too powerful, so instead of a flat nerf, an indirect nerf is presented. Pounce is buffed* but overall damage potential or dps of the class is lowered due to headchomp being slower (plus the human buffs). Goons are weaker, they just have a semi-overpowered feature.

*which pounce was already powerful in stage 1

temple · « **Reply #86 on:** December 31, 2009, 12:59:57 am »

Rants are weaker

The new trample is powerful. Powerful as hell. But lets talk about how a rant plays.

Drawbacks

Big
Slow
Can't jump
Has to trample to move fast

Advantages

Decent slash damage
Double damage on head shots
Can chain tramples consistently
Huge health

1.2 fucks up the advantages

1.2 Changes

Huge health (that takes forever to regenerate)
Huge hitbox (which becomes a drawback due to the above point)
Slower trample charge (which makes lack of jumping and speed worse)
Slower slash (which makes trampling into combat even more dangerous)

So what happens is you trample into combat, take a slash, and become a sitting duck. You can't just trample out, you can't just slash your way out. You just soak up hits. Rants feel more like goons, just with more hitpoints and less evasion. The lack of slash speed (and thus slash DPS) can never be substituted by having a powerful trample.

BBBBut....but aliens are supposed to work as a team now!!!!
I'll address this below

*******************************************************************
Humans have advantages that are intrinsic to the team. These are things that aliens can not do.
Humans can

Move and attack independently
Attack outside of their enemies' range
Easily attack in groups without damaging each other (focus fire)

Aliens can't attack and retreat at the same time. Since their attacks are melee ranged, and some are tied to a motion, alien attacks are dependent on their movement.
An alien is always in a human's range when they attack. Many situations allow humans to fight outside an alien's range.

The biggest advantage of all is the fact that group of humans can deal damage much easier than a group of aliens. Take any group of humans, place their backs to a wall, and they can deal more damage safely than aliens. Take any group of aliens and have them descend on a human. It is chaos. Aliens have to move to get in range but they can't move through each other. If 2 aliens are both in range of the human, then they are also in range of each other's attacks. Its a mess and takes way more coordination. This is the crowding problem of aliens

So all this talk about aliens requiring team work now is doubly handicapping them. Aliens have to overcome an intrinsic weakness to the team (crowding) to overcome the newly impossed weakness (nerfed regen/buffed humans/nerfed classes). By making aliens depend on a basilisk or more coordination to be effective, it forces them to cause more difficulty for each other later when they go to attack.

Plague Bringer · « **Reply #87 on:** December 31, 2009, 01:40:20 am »

Quote from: temple on December 31, 2009, 12:59:57 am

tl;dq

This is perhaps the best post I've read on these forums.

temple · « **Reply #88 on:** December 31, 2009, 02:06:24 am »

I put this in three posts instead of one really long one.
********************************************************************************

BBBBBBBut the stats, look at the stats!!!!!!! OMG Aliens have better win stats. STATS!!!!!!

Plenty of players can explain why aliens win more than humans. There is no point to rehashing the same points made and that should be common knowledge by now. I'll give a different take on the stat discrepency.

Stage 1, rifle vs dretch, the rifle player will win more than a dretch. Period. If rifleman can aim and sees the dretch, he should kill it. Take a group of rifles and a group of dretches (this is a common scenario on ACTS), and the group of rifles should win with less loses.

This proposition justifies 3 things about aliens I want to point out.
1) Aliens are not always overpowered, especially dretches
2) Aliens have to use teamwork in 1.1.
3) Aliens need the 'overpowered' dragoons and rants

1) Aliens can and will lose if all they have are dretches. Humans can and do easily reach stage 3 simply by killing dretches. The fact that humans don't win have more to with the challenge of transfering dretching killing skills to base killing skills. We have all seen it. Human team mows down waves of dretch but can't kill the alien base. It isn't alien's fault. It is the human team's fault for not developing those skills. When humans actually have the skill to kill bases (on top of dretch killing), they usually win.

2) Aliens would rarely make it past stage 1 or win if they didn't already use enough teamwork. Using 'more teamwork' as a justification for nerfing aliens isn't valid. Because dretches are easily killed by competent human players with the default rifle, aliens have to rely on a time worn military tactic of the forlorn hope. Meaning that the leading aliens rush, dies, but the second wave finishes off the enemy. This is used all through out the alien stages for attacking and is probably why aliens are so much better at killing bases when sudden death comes.* Aliens have to develop those skill early on. Humans can just camp.

3)Since dretches, basilisks, and to some degree marauders are easily killed by groups of humans (with a default rifle no less), dragoons and rants are needed to tip the balance in their favor. Aliens have to suffer more losses to kill *good* human players, so the low evo cost of dragoons is slightly justified here. Not only that, but as humans stage up, the losses become heavier for aliens. So the rant is pretty much the only alien that can stand up to groups of humans with advanced weapons or armor. If humans actually played stage 3 like they played stage 1, rants wouldn't be much of a threat.

Since playing aliens does some intrinsic challenges (things that humans can do that aliens can't), aliens are far more deserving and suited to use their powerful classes. A dretch plays similiar to a goon, goons play similiar to a rant. If aliens can make it to stage 3, they are better able to exploit its advantages.

Humans on the other hand do not exploit the advantages of their stage progression as much. MD'ing dretches is different than killing an alien base. In theory, the human weapon skills transfer much easier than skills of different alien classes. A gun is a gun. But the act of sieging a base is much harder than killing or camping. So, humans should be able to transfer their skills to win but rarely do.

The human is weaker than aliens. The human team is stronger than aliens. It was the best of times, it was the worst of times. Humans just have to develop better skills. Fiddling with the numbers won't change that. Tremulous lacks from it simple objectives and probably turrets in preparing human players to win.* Aliens win in spite of the odds because aliens just have to be smarter and more accurate to make it out of stage 1. Humans don't face a real challenge unless there is a *good* goon player or until stage 3. So, they lose more when games go to SD or when goons hit the field early.

Finally, /share and /donate have ruined the game. I remember when share and donate didn't exist. Rants and goons were less common. 'Killwhoring' was a drawback because it didn't spread evos around to the team. So if a goon or rant with 9 evos meant that 9 evos didn't get used to make more classes to support the killwhoring player. In order to have a team of rants outside of your base meant that the other team was far better than yours. Not that someone could pull down console and type. Remove /share and /donate and your server would be the better for it.

*The base to base fighting gameplay of Tremulous makes tactics like the forlorn hope too accessible and effective. Alien teamwork isn't necessarily better or harder in this case, its more that Tremulous doesn't require more skills than simply organizing rushes.

Note: liberal use of the word should here. Honestly, learn to shoot.

Plague Bringer · « **Reply #89 on:** December 31, 2009, 03:07:51 am »

Not meaning to steal your thunder, temple. ;]

I think that the use of the word teamwork is hardly proper when referring to the alien team. It is assumed that the aliens should be able to work as a collective. This assumption is correct. But how they work is completely and totally different than how the humans work.
Humans are most effective in groups, as, like temple said, they have a strong ability to focus fire. Aliens, however, are largely better off as soloers. This is due to their low range and high health. Aliens require coordination and teamwork at the enemy base, but (barring the first three offensive classes) they are very effective reaching the enemy base alone. Humans, however, require teamwork to reach the enemy base (depending on the path that they take, the size of the teams, and the player-skill-stack).

I feel like a lot of the changes in 1.2 try to force teamwork on aliens to reach human base which, really, shouldn't be too much of an issue. One of the things that drew me to Tremulous originally was the fact that tyrants were terrifying. So were goons. Hell, so were maras! And this was all solo. I loved Tremulous because it was great accomplishment when my buds and I took down that rant. It was an accomplishment when we heard that fuckin' 'goon moan for it's little life. And man, aliens were fun as hell to play! Each class had a very distinct role and a different style of play. Now, they still do, but they've been all jumbled up and switched around and maybe, even, a little bit broken. Don't get me wrong now, I've had a lot of fun playing humans on GPP, but aliens? I guess they just don't make 'em like they used to.
There's something about them now that simply makes them ineffective alone (could it be the nerfed attack speed?). Against turrets? Yeah, you should be switching out snipers and rants. Hell, against a persistent group of advancing humans, you should be switching out your snipers and rants. This has always been true! But against a group of two or three? You earned that fuckin' 'rant. It should work well.
Of course, this whole bit could be discounted with "all classes are great if you master them!" and yeah, I agree, they are! Always have been. But much of these changes have made aliens not restricted by skill, but by the game's coded rules.

Odd formatting to make this seem less like a terrifying wall.

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Author Topic: Gameplay Preview Phase 1 Results (Read 197898 times)

MitSugna