This game is a complete mess.

[Thorn]

Poieo , go to ur local weapons dealer , buy a shotgun , aim for ur own fucking head , and fucking fire the bastard . get ur familiy to record and upload the splat on the forums

[Henners]

Incidentally I just played a couple of rounds, and despite the humans camping excessively it was some of the most fun I've had playing the game. I managed to get the alien team well organised with a good builder and some decent players, and we pulled off some amazing raids on human hunting squads and their incredibly dense fortified base.

The fun of the game is what you make of it - if you set out with the attitude, oh no they are camping this is going to be boring you will indeed find it so. Try saying to yourself, ok their camping, lets get some tactics and organisation. I organised the team such that even the dretches had an important part to play, with killing areas the larger aliens could draw the humans into, and then have the dretches finish them off.

Now the sad thing about this was that I had to play a few rounds with these people first, before they would start listening to my tactics, as they simply wouldnt listen to a "nobody". Once it was established that I was a good player, people started listening, and the teamwork all fell into place leading to some awesome games. The humans werent with leadership either, and very nearly pulled off a move to the elevator room at the last moment, but a quick responce from my reserve adv marauder got there in time to critically damage the reactor before the rest of the alien team arrived.

As I say, the fun in this game is what you make of it - tell yourself its rubbish and unbalanced and thats how the play will seem to you. Actually put some effort in, and you will get a good reward out

[Stakhanov]

Is it just me , or this forum lacks moderators ?

MOD EDIT:  It's just you.  -- Dolby

Poieo , go to ur local weapons dealer , buy a shotgun , aim for ur own fucking head , and fucking fire the bastard . get ur familiy to record and upload the splat on the forums

Ahem.

The NS community may have had a rather closed caste of admins , but at least those kept the forum decent.

And as the above post says , teamwork can make Tremulous games very nice. But there are no real incentives for it , nor intuitive ways to learn it.

[PIE]

Is it just me , or this forum lacks moderators ?

The NS community may have had a rather closed caste of admins , but at least those kept the forum decent.

And as the above post says , teamwork can make Tremulous games very nice. But there are no real incentives for it , nor intuitive ways to learn it.

Whats not decent about the forums?

Incentive = win
Intuitiveness = builders build, defenders defend, attackers attack...

I like the fact that people can control how they play as opposed to being teathered to the way the creaters or someone else might WANT them to play.

[Neo]

I know this might be a bit offtopic, but why is it whenever you argue with a troll the first real comeback is always about the language in the posts against them? Even if it is perfectly normal english.

[Stakhanov]

Trolls don't make sense - but they may have some rhetoric skills. If you take the time to read his posts , you can hardly take offense of his flaming nonsense.

[Lava Croft]

How the fuck did I miss this thread? Oh, wait. Nevermind. Poieo, please spend your spare time playing CS, er, NS. I''m pretty sure everybody would be happier that way.

[Thorn]

How the fuck did I miss this thread? Oh, wait. Nevermind. Poieo, please spend your spare time playing CS, er, NS. I''m pretty sure everybody would be happier that way.

I really dont wanna say this but
I AGREE WITH LAVA CROFT ON THIS POINT!

ok now i've calmed down a little
  If this game was a complete mess
why would people play trem? Tremulous
is actually one of the best games i have ever seen.

Oh and btw what movie did u take this off of? "Do u know me jackass"
HAHAHAHAHAHA THATS FUNNY!!!!!

[kozak6]

Generally speaking, you often get better responses if you post a little bit more politely, as you come off as rather insulting.

Really, it sounds like you might be better informed if you played the game for another week or two.  The balance isn't perfect, and games vary dramatically depending on the composition of the teams, but really, the balance is fairly good, considering.

[zeta]

i like rush rush rush, camp camp camp

it makes for interesting gameplay

this isnt quake u know

[Chaos Weevil]

Trolls don't make sense - but they may have some rhetoric skills. If you take the time to read his posts , you can hardly take offense of his flaming nonsense.

I read all of his posts all the way through, and still took offence at the fact that he called the Admin of the forum those things!

Not many Admins would take that.  I know a few that would KOS(Kill On Sight) anyone who insulted them like that.  Timbo must have a very cool head.

Anyway, it has become quite obvious that you are a troll and a flamer, not worthy of my time.  Do I give a damn about what you think of my 2nd favorite game?  See below:

[Seffylight]

Comic Book Guy:  Last night's Itchy & Scratchy was, without a doubt, the worst episode ever. Rest assured I was on the internet within minutes registering my disgust throughout the world.
Bart: Hey, I know it wasn't great, but what right do you have to complain?
Comic Book Guy:  As a loyal viewer, I feel they owe me.
Bart: What? They're giving you thousands of hours of entertainment for free. What could they possibly owe you? I mean, if anything, you owe them.
Comic Book Guy:  Worst. Episode. Ever.

'Nuff said.

[PIE]

Comic Book Guy:  Last night's Itchy & Scratchy was, without a doubt, the worst episode ever. Rest assured I was on the internet within minutes registering my disgust throughout the world.
Bart: Hey, I know it wasn't great, but what right do you have to complain?
Comic Book Guy:  As a loyal viewer, I feel they owe me.
Bart: What? They're giving you thousands of hours of entertainment for free. What could they possibly owe you? I mean, if anything, you owe them.
Comic Book Guy:  Worst. Episode. Ever.

'Nuff said.

... yes... feel free to get your money back if you didn't enjoy the game.

[Howitzer]

Actually, right now, you're leeching money because the Dev's could've put this game in retail.
(There have been games 50x worse in retail, ex: Titan Quest, which is near unplayable because of bugs, ... )

[Stof]

Actually, right now, you're leeching money because the Dev's could've put this game in retail.
(There have been games 50x worse in retail, ex: Titan Quest, which is near unplayable because of bugs, ... )

Well, Titan Quest works flawlesly here thank you. And it is quite an enjoyable game too !

[Howitzer]

It does?
My local game-community put up a forum for it and there are 28 topics in it, 24 concerning crashes, bugs and loss of player-profiles :s
(Is it really that good?)

[Stof]

It does?
My local game-community put up a forum for it and there are 28 topics in it, 24 concerning crashes, bugs and loss of player-profiles :s
(Is it really that good?)

Yes it works although I have to agree that it works much better without any kind of NoDVD ( too bad )

And I found it fun, it is by no means a Diablo 2 but that last one always bored me to death once I had killed Diablo ( Baal ) once. Titan Quest I had no difficulties finding the 60 hours it takes to finish the game in Legendary

Also, it explains a lot why I played very few tremulous games for the last week

[Neo]

Damn, we thought we had just got lucky

[Lava Croft]

this isnt quake u know

Oh, it isn't?

[Rekov]

OH MY GOD TREM IS SO WRONG BECAUSE I DIE A LOT! AS AN EXPERIENCED NS PLAYER I REQUEST.. NAY, I DEMAND! THAT THE GAME BE ALTERED IN WAYS THAT MAKE IT EASIER FOR ME

If this is the attitude the trem devs have Im not so sure I will be playing much longer,

[Lava Croft]

If this is the attitude the trem devs have Im not so sure I will be playing much longer,

Don't let the door hit you on the way out back to CS, er, NS

[SLAVE|Mietz]

OH MY GOD TREM IS SO WRONG BECAUSE I DIE A LOT! AS AN EXPERIENCED NS PLAYER I REQUEST.. NAY, I DEMAND! THAT THE GAME BE ALTERED IN WAYS THAT MAKE IT EASIER FOR ME

If this is the attitude the trem devs have Im not so sure I will be playing much longer,

bye bye *fake tears of loss*

[kraagenskul]

To poieo:

Making a subject stating the game is a complete mess and then sounding like an asshole in your commentary is not going to make the devs listen to you, hence the large all caps reply from the dev. You had some legitimate problems, many which are addressed in other forum articles.  But it looks like to everyone you played half a dozen games, couldn't succeed using methods from other games, got frustrated and went right to the forums without reading anyone else's feedback.  In case you haven't noticed, the game is still a work in progress.  

To those threatning to leave because the dev replied in said manner, did you even read poieo's email?

My personal favorite line from poieo  is "I am the epitome of ballsy playing." which basically just made me laugh and not take you seriously in the least.

In short, hey poieo: Fuck off and go back to NS.

[phaedrus]

OH MY GOD TREM IS SO WRONG BECAUSE I DIE A LOT! AS AN EXPERIENCED NS PLAYER I REQUEST.. NAY, I DEMAND! THAT THE GAME BE ALTERED IN WAYS THAT MAKE IT EASIER FOR ME

If this is the attitude the trem devs have Im not so sure I will be playing much longer,

Honestly, Rekov, I've seen the complaints of the OP levelled at Trem many times in just the last couple months.  The consensus among the regulars (the core of the community) is that basically he needs to spend more time with the game, because those are really features, not bugs.  

You'll have to excuse the Unix guy here, but I'm with that crowd.  Some things need to be learned to be enjoyed, and they're worth it.  If you mow down the learning curve, you deny access to what was at the top.  Some things can't be dumbed down.

There are a ton of suggestions made in this forum, and everyone here is working on a volunteer basis.  This isn't a software company.  They aren't going to make every change you request (hell, they wouldn't even if they were a software company).  But, the situation is better than if it was a software company.  You have all of the game source+art and access to all of the tools you could need to modify and improve it.  There's also a perfect feature for trying out new gameplay rules, they're called 'mods'.

As it is, the game play is in a stable state.  It's well balanced and people like it the way it is right now.  I think we, as a community can accept change, but you've got to show us the code first.

But really, the OP was fucking rude.  That was not polite criticism.  And poieo, I got the fact that you didn't want Trem to be exactly like NS, that you weren't part of that crowd--rather that you were just using it to compare and contrast.  But that doesn't change the fact that you're a complete asshole, and that you made that fact abundantly clear in your first post.

Never mind the pure irony that it's been years since i could say good things about NS, or that i left that community because i was sick of it being full of myopic, insular, egotistical staff fed by sycophantic "fans".

Hmm, sounds like you belong there.  I'm with everyone else, go back to your NS.

To sum it up, this stuff comes up over and over again from people who haven't played long enough to properly criticize the game.  But this guy was dick about it, so we blew up at him, because he was being an asshole about the dev's baby.  I don't blame the devs.  I think the attitude of the devs that you should be looking at is they put a lot of care and thought in to balancing the game just right and keeping their artistic integrity.  Beyond that, they had the good will to open the game up completely and release it under a FOSS and CC license, so that everyone can help and join in.

Fuck poieo.  He needs to grow up.  Rekov, leave if you want to.  I think you've misjudged what Who was saying.  

Jeff

[Timbo]

Is it just me , or this forum lacks moderators ?

It's not that there are no moderators, it's that my attitude is that most forums are over-moderated. Not agreeing with someone are not good grounds for forcibly stopping the discussion. Likewise, insults aren't good grounds for moderation -- they're only words. You can insult me or anyone else you like here, I don't care (however you shouldn't always expect me to take you seriously if you do).

If somebody is making an ass of themself, by NOT locking the topic you're not giving them the excuse that you've silenced them prematurely. Utimately, the posts you make speak for themselves and anybody can make up their own mind based on the full evidence available to them, not some over-zealous moderator.

The only topics I would actively lock here are those containing illegal material (by any sensible set of laws), discussion of game cheats/exploits and obvious spam (by bot or otherwise). In the history of this forum, only one person has ever been banned, and then only temporarily.

OH MY GOD TREM IS SO WRONG BECAUSE I DIE A LOT! AS AN EXPERIENCED NS PLAYER I REQUEST.. NAY, I DEMAND! THAT THE GAME BE ALTERED IN WAYS THAT MAKE IT EASIER FOR ME

If this is the attitude the trem devs have Im not so sure I will be playing much longer,

In the same way I'm (mostly) not going to restrict what people say on the forum, that extends to include the developers of Tremulous. You need to realise we're not a corporate entity, and are all individuals entitled to their own opinion. As such we have no "group attitude", "corporate outlook" or "marketing strategy". We're really just a bunch of guys who did this for a bit of fun (not that it's always been fun :roll:).

As far as the topic in hand goes, I'm not really prepared to have a serious discussion with anyone who struggles to construct a sentence that doesn't contain some form of unnecessary insult, especially when according to the stats, their opinions are based on less than 5 hours of gameplay.

[Neo]

However this thread is kinda pointless now, its all just late comers beating on someone who has already left.

[Malicious Goo]

Now might be a good time to say, Thanks Devs!  I love Tremulous!  Yes, a few issues/bugs could be worked out, but it would be quite sad if gameplay was drastically changed.  The current set up is quite fun, and unlike other games I've played.  

Lovin it,
Goo

[Stakhanov]

It's not that there are no moderators, it's that my attitude is that most forums are over-moderated. Not agreeing with someone are not good grounds for forcibly stopping the discussion. Likewise, insults aren't good grounds for moderation -- they're only words. You can insult me or anyone else you like here, I don't care (however you shouldn't always expect me to take you seriously if you do).

If somebody is making an ass of themself, by NOT locking the topic you're not giving them the excuse that you've silenced them prematurely. Utimately, the posts you make speak for themselves and anybody can make up their own mind based on the full evidence available to them, not some over-zealous moderator.

The only topics I would actively lock here are those containing illegal material (by any sensible set of laws), discussion of game cheats/exploits and obvious spam (by bot or otherwise). In the history of this forum, only one person has ever been banned, and then only temporarily.

Hmmm. It is up to the admins to choose how to deal with people insulting them , either implicit disdain or active silencing ; the issue is with the community at large. Everyone else has no such choice , and there seems to be no ignore feature on this forum. Flaming threads ought to be locked not for being oh so shocking , but because they can keep growing with more and more graphical insults as morons are attracted to them. It is not pleasant to read such flames grafting themselves on normal threads as squabbles expand. The general consensus is that locked flame threads are better off dead , and people seeking to revive them are total noobs.

Of course it is impossible to remove evidence of the slightest personal attack in large communities (the NS forums were a good example of this - veiled hatreds between members or castes could be felt , even when sarcasm was ban worthy) but it is important for moderators to intervene in time and say "it's over , kids"

Excess freedom is not harmless. When people act like sheeps , you ought to herd them the right way.

[Lava Croft]

I would like to state that Who is a fucking bastard,

but that I am actually quite happy with the fact that his replies sort out the people that  this community does not need, and guides them on their way out. To CS, er, NS.

[Stakhanov]

See what I mean ?

And what's with the insulting comparison between CS and NS ? We NSers always tell moronic whining noobs to go back to CS , what do you think