Fireteams?

[player1]

OK, I'll start this off by saying that I'm not a great Quake-player. I only really got into computer games in time for Quake3Arena, which I really dug and played all the way through (yes, on the easiest setting, no doubt). I played online, and played TeamArena, too, but other players had obviously much greater skill and/or experience at shooter games.

One thing I do know about Quake-based games is that standing still is a good way to die, and that jumping, strafing and dodging is the best way to live. But near the human base, where you have fire support, people still run right in front of each other and the turrets. I saw so many noobs feeding on a server yesterday, it made me wonder - does anybody try to defend? Isn't there a point at which to get out of the other guy's shot? This is why the humans get crushed in ATCS, sometimes. One basi on the reactor, and they all shoot each other.  :-?    :eek:

Even when attacking, many players string out so much, and then instead of running back past you when they are low on health, they jump around like a maniac, and you can't provide any cover fire. I know this ain't Rainbow Six, but hey, STOP BLOCKING MY SHOT IF YOU"RE JUST GOING TO FEED THEM UP TO GOONS IN STAGE ONE! There, I said it. Sorry about the all caps. They just didn't seem to know what "stop feeding" meant. Thanks.

PlayerOne feels better, having got that off his chest

On a related note, is there a quick rebuild for the human base on the platform with the big green tube in the room with all the I-beams & X-braces, or are you pretty much up the river from the start? Aliens were at S3, we were at S1. No help building, 3 humans against 1 alien, fed him to goon in about 5 seconds flat. Turrets strung out. Pounce=dead teammate. Server starts to fill, Tyrants appear. Help? :O  D:    :cry:

[_Equilibrium_]

telling people not to feed rarely works. only more experienced players even pay attention to that, and they don't always follow what you say. the best option is to kill the aliens instead of feeding them. and don't go out by yourself against goons in s1 or tyrants in s3.

[Odin]

I find it funny that when people stay at the base to defend, people complain about "campers", but all of a sudden when people actually try to attack, people complain about "feeders"(even if they don't actually feed).

Can we play the game without complaining about other people's tactics? Which would you rather? Have a camper(which can win the game if done right) or a feeder(which is intentional death by enemy)?

[Dance Commander]

I find it funny that when people complain about people who stay at the base to defend, it's called "camping", but all of a sudden when people actually try to attack, it's called "feeding"(even if you don't actually feed), and people complain.

Can we play the game without complaining about other people's tactics?

amen

[_Equilibrium_]

very good point Odin. but still, you can avoid both those types o fcomplainers by going out and killing aliens early.

[player1]

Yeah, I tried to rearrange the turrets and defend the nodes.

Actually, with the weak default turret placement in that particular map (I like how Tremulous forces people to learn to rearrange stuff themselves, that's what it's all about), I was happy when the turrets got destroyed, so I could put some closer together.

I wasn't going away from the base once I realized my teammates didn't know where the "M" key was. Usually, people will get an alien to chase them, and bring them back towards the turrets. After they gooned up the dretch by giving away easy kills, they went up against the goon! Solo. Around the corner, in the dark. Make him rush the turrrets or cry and call us campers, but don't stand in the doorway dying. Run back to base and get another medkit. Or something.

Apparently they didn't realize how many points they lost with each headbite, and that all he had to do was touch them once more to kill them. It is 96 points of health, right? You have 4 health points after you're headbit. If you don't heal immediately, you might as well stop firing your weapon, too, and just lay down and die. It's suicide. I wonder if they ever even played Quake. Maybe they don't know what the syringe icon means. I mean, I'm terrible at Tremulous. Really bad. But I know enough to run away and heal.

I don't know how people who can't kill little bugs by themselves think that they can kill big bugs by themselves. I guess they just don't understand that its not all about kills. Especially you they are dying, not killing. If the humans didn't need the turrets, they wouldn't be there.

I have to admit, it was pretty funny. Until the server got full and I got busy trying not to die, I was even joking with the goon player about it. The spectators laughed their butts off, then joined in at Tyrant time. I think we held out about twenty minutes, even with reinforcements. I don't think we ever got past Stage One. A sad day for the humans. I didn't die until the goon got help. I like stand behind turrets.

PlayerOne thinks all Armouries should bear a sign that says
"Please Don't Feed the Aliens"   :wink:

[player1]

I find it funny that when people stay at the base to defend, people complain about "campers", but all of a sudden when people actually try to attack, people complain about "feeders"(even if they don't actually feed).

Can we play the game without complaining about other people's tactics? Which would you rather? Have a camper(which can win the game if done right) or a feeder(which is intentional death by enemy)?

Well, someone needs to attack, and someone needs to defend, no doubt.


I'm not really complaining about these particular players' "tactics", since they didn't have any. Humans are pretty weak against good dretches in stage one, but then aliens are pretty weak against good attackers. I'm not complaining about people attacking, per se, but you can attack in a way that makes sense. Draw them into cover fire. Run away when you are hurt. Heal when you need to. And if you are so bad that you die in the double-digit figures in the single-digit minutes, you should seek cover or a more well-lit area to try to survive a little. That's why I defend. I'm new. I'm terrible. I don't need the enemy to have better weapons, they can already kill me just fine.

Sure, I practice attacking. It's the only way to learn. But I think dretches, which can climb on walls and hide in the dark, will eat n00bs for lunch.

Sorry for the double-posting, several things happened semi-simultaneously (including dinner).

Anyway, I appreciate players who can attack. Their kills help the whole team reach the next stage, so I get better weapons, and cooler things to build. But when players can't even get out of base without dying, they shouldn't just respawn and run the same way again. This dretch was just camping in the same spot, killing them over and over. I swear he was headchomping them both and letting them shoot each other. They both got killed just inside or outside the same doorway, again and again. Sure, run out and get a dretch to chase you. If he bites you, run back in here and we'll shoot him, while he tries for the kill. And please, please, please, press the"M" key. You're not going far with 4 health. That's falling damage for an intentional jump down a 20 foot dropoff. A hangnail will kill you.

It was like seeing someone play Quake for the very first time. Run backwards. Heal. Stop shooting each other. At least if you're not going to provide cover fire, run out different doors! No, they'd take one step into the hallway, get headchomped in the exact same spot, and begin spinning in circles, firing wildly.

[holyknight]

I hate camping, but when I KNOW I'm feeding, I stop.
And whenever a person I respect or think I know he/she is good (not those annoying noobs who think they are best and all those crap), I listen to them.

[temple]

IMO, its better to feed than camp.  At least you learn something when you feed.

[treminator]

Fireteams? I thought this thread was about implementing something ET style like.

[player1]

Anyway, does anybody use fields of fire, cover fire, waiting for one enemy to detach from their team and pursue alone, etc.?

I didn't mean to start a camper vs. feeder thread.

Also, does anyone else defend/assist the builder?

I think there's a time to get kills and a time to watch the spawnpoints. I mean, you'll never win by defending alone. But there's a difference between attacking and feeding. Just like there's a difference between camping and defending. Just because you're attacking, I'm not gonna be all like "Feederz" if you die once or twice. Even if you're all like "C4mp3r" just because I wanna defend.

But if you just die repeatedly, never get any kills, never get near their builds, and level the enemy up with your senseless deaths, AND THEN, keep running right at them, after they are stage three, and we are still stage one, then I don't think you understand that Tremulous is a team game. Sure if you suck, get some practice. But try to learn from those deaths. If you are 3 on 1 and he's whipping your ass, maybe you need to try something different. Oh, great now he a goon. Could you at least stop dying 'til I get the turrets grouped together? Go out the other door... oh, well.

[DASPRiD]

Oh yeah, I know those humans. Yesterday, they feeded me in less than 1 minute to goon, then they always came out of their base in groups with 3 peeps. Well, they didn't live long

[janev]

Especially you they are dying, not killing. If the humans didn't need the turrets, they wouldn't be there.

Wrong. The turrets are there to defend the human vital structures not the players. If you/your team suck then you deserve to lose.. Right? Why should the game be drawn out to sudden death/ time limit? One of the most annoying things for good alien players is that humans sit on their turrets powerless to do anything because the server buildpoints are set a bit too high. Of course this also goes for tyrants that just sit at a corner afraid to attack a base of riflemen and turrets.
 
A very good goon is scary and you will probably not survive the encounter but that very good goon will probably not get the required three frags with a dretch vs a very good rifleman.

Imho it's better to feed, play the game as it's meant to be played and lose then to camp and win.

[^Black]

I find it funny that when people stay at the base to defend, people complain about "campers", but all of a sudden when people actually try to attack, people complain about "feeders"(even if they don't actually feed).

Can we play the game without complaining about other people's tactics? Which would you rather? Have a camper(which can win the game if done right) or a feeder(which is intentional death by enemy)?

Believe it or not, there are some players who can kill the aliens.

[Plague Bringer]

GTFO MY WAY, NOOB

Try playing on karith, retarted hummies always run to the left....run around in circles at the end of the hall, and give you no opportunity to kill the dretches swarming them without a TK.

[janev]

GTFO MY WAY, NOOB

Try playing on karith, retarted hummies always run to the left....run around in circles at the end of the hall, and give you no opportunity to kill the dretches swarming them without a TK.

So grab the tk + the dretch +-1 right???

[Matt2k10]

Believe it or not, there are some players who can kill the aliens.

lies

[kozak6]

Fireteams? I thought this thread was about implementing something ET style like.

+1

[Dracone]

This is why I have my trusty binds, "OH OOPS U DIED!" and "OH YOU DIDN'T SURVIVE OOPS!" I don't use them though...a bit too extreme to say to someone when you tk them...

[Lava Croft]

The only reason people shoot each other is because they are all egocentric bastards that think about nothing but their own obsolete kill-count.

[Plague Bringer]

if they thought only about their kill count then wouldnt they try to NOT shoot at a teammate?

[player1]

I don't think they realize the difference. They're just shooting in the general direction of enemies. When they're not spinning in circles, unloading clips in a general panic.  

[Glunnator]

That poll sucks... I wanna click both!  

[player1]

I know. Conflicted, right? That's how I felt when I started this thread.

The other day I accidentally TK'd a player with TEAMMATE as part of his handle. So the message I got was You have just killed TEAMMATE TEAMMATE Unnamed Player (or w/e the rest of his tag was.) It was so funny I took a screenshot. Oh, my excuse, um, the alien sun was in my eyes, and a lisk ate my homework, and there was a mara on the reactor and it was the switch over to daylight savings time. Um, actually he was low on health and failed to stay to the right. So I shot him. Daid. Lost my creds and everything. Oh well. Live and learn.

[player1]

Especially you they are dying, not killing. If the humans didn't need the turrets, they wouldn't be there.

Wrong. The turrets are there to defend the human vital structures not the players. If you/your team suck then you deserve to lose.. Right? Why should the game be drawn out to sudden death/ time limit? One of the most annoying things for good alien players is that humans sit on their turrets powerless to do anything because the server buildpoints are set a bit too high. Of course this also goes for tyrants that just sit at a corner afraid to attack a base of riflemen and turrets.
 
A very good goon is scary and you will probably not survive the encounter but that very good goon will probably not get the required three frags with a dretch vs a very good rifleman.

Imho it's better to feed, play the game as it's meant to be played and lose then to camp and win.

Well, janev et al, I took your advice and went and joined the attackers (I finally use the sprint key, ftw) and yesterday I shot a goon right in the ass with a shotgun, and it felt great! Let 'em attack somebody, join the points pack at the front line, and try to get the kill. I understand now. I should cred up, or shut up. Thanks. It made me a better player. :wink:      

Edited for spelling 'cuz I was in a hurry and got excited

[player1]

Very good point Odin. But still, you can avoid both those types of complainers by going out and killing aliens early.

Sorry about the double-posting, I forgot to comment on this. Best advice I've gotten in a while. I would even say "by going out and killing enemies early." Stage One. You're weak and scared. So are they. Kill them now, before they can destroy your base. Demoralize them. Get those frags and evos/creds. Then you will be ready for Stage Two. Thanks. Very helpful. Also obvious, but I'm a little slow.

Quote mildly edited for clarity. Hope you don't mind. It's often easier to ask forgiveness than permission.

[.Long-Range]

I caught on to that concept last night. That's when I also discovered how to purchase weapons and gain credits. I didn't even have an idea of where I could locate my total credit amount. All I bought was equipment such as light armor.
Then I realized you didn't even have to kill aliens for credit. You just needed to damage them (I think?). I found it extremely hard to kill aliens with just your basic rifle. Once I learned about credits and general spending and selling, I could fully enjoy Tremulous and the benefits of being on the human side.

[_Equilibrium_]

@ player1: there is an edit button. use it. no need to triple post.

@long-range: if you hurt an alien, and it dies, then you get creds. if you just hurt it and it runs away and heals up, you get jack.

[Mispeled]

I find it funny that when people stay at the base to defend, people complain about "campers", but all of a sudden when people actually try to attack, people complain about "feeders"(even if they don't actually feed).

Can we play the game without complaining about other people's tactics? Which would you rather? Have a camper(which can win the game if done right) or a feeder(which is intentional death by enemy)?

There is a such thing as middle ground between camping and feeding. You can be far enough out that you're not sitting on your turrets but still be relatively safe.

[Plague Bringer]

@ player1: there is an edit button. use it. no need to triple post.

@long-range: if you hurt an alien, and it dies, then you get creds. if you just hurt it and it runs away and heals up, you get jack.

Half the total damage to an alien (throughout it's life-span) and another player does half, you'll each get a portion of the credits for killing that alien. You get alot of credits for assists in Tremulous.