Author Topic: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide  (Read 42861 times)

St. Vrayne

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #30 on: August 12, 2008, 06:31:35 pm »
This guide is excellent!  It's a shame none of our Void members took the initiative to make something as needed as this.  Hell, you should have a guild of your own, as much work as you do.  Keep it up Hendrich!  You've almost got me as a fan!

Hendrich

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #31 on: August 12, 2008, 08:15:36 pm »
Wow, thx! I'll keep up the good work, its nice to know soemone out there is appreciates my work, I'll keep it up for people like you.  ;D

I'm also updating the guide again. :P

PS: To tell you the truth, I thought the guide I made really sucked. :P

daenyth

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #32 on: August 12, 2008, 08:40:49 pm »
A nice howto on cleaning up windows. You neglect, though, to mention anything about how video games cards impact performance, or how HDD speed will impact swap speed. Might be useful for clueless winnoobs but beyond that it doesn't really seem to be helpful.

EDIT: Fixed stupid brain fart.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2008, 06:55:23 pm by daenyth »
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Hendrich

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #33 on: August 12, 2008, 11:01:03 pm »
Quote
A nice howto on cleaning up windows. You neglect, though, to mention anything about how video games impact performance

Sorry, but, wtf? The point of this guide was to increase performance on tremulous, so of course we all know playing tremulous does impact performance of the computer, duh, thats why I made this. If video games didn't impact performance, then obviously Tremulous would run faster. Whats the point of telling everyone Tremulous slows down your computer, because thats what everyone expects, explosions, lag and 3D models.

Quote
or how HDD speed will impact swap speed. Might be useful for clueless winnoobs but beyond that it doesn't really seem to be helpful

Your right about the swapfile thing, I should add that later on, and your absoloutly right, this guide was made for clueless winnoobs who doesn't know how to make tremulous run faster, because theres a whole shitload of them playing Tremulous. This guide can also give out information others didn't know before, but I can't give out tips on how to drastically imrpove your performance without the Moderators on these fourms questioning the risks involving those tips, so this guide has to be pretty basic a sense.

But thier right, sometimes you don't have to do risky things just to improve performance. I don't know any programs on the top of my head that increases speed without risk, but if you have ANY tips or programs you reccommend to the guide I'll check em out. If they're good enough I'lll add em to the guide.

St. Vrayne

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #34 on: August 13, 2008, 03:08:57 am »
Wow, thx! I'll keep up the good work, its nice to know soemone out there is appreciates my work, I'll keep it up for people like you.  ;D

I'm also updating the guide again. :P

PS: To tell you the truth, I thought the guide I made really sucked. :P

All the guides that Powa will eventually add to our Guild thread that I made will probably suck, but I have the courage to post them, just like you.  But seriously, this guide is excellent.  I didn't understand the half of it, but what really got to me was the thoroughness and sincerity of it. 

Again, keep up the good work!

cactusfrog

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #35 on: August 13, 2008, 03:52:47 am »
maybe someone already posted it but i would really like to know the codes to get tremulous to use my 2 gigs of ram a duel processors even better the codes to speed up tremed.exe

Hendrich

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #36 on: August 13, 2008, 04:23:58 am »
Quote
maybe someone already posted it but i would really like to know the codes to get tremulous to use my 2 gigs of ram a duel processors even better the codes to speed up tremed.exe

Hmm, a challenge! Done and done, I'll be off trying to figure this problem out, because sometimes shit liek this happens, that Tremulous uses only a certin maximum amount of RAM because if Tremulous takes up all your RAM Windows won't run, why? Because Windows needs RAM too. I know there are codes/commands that tells tremulous to use more RAM, and I'll be looking for em.

I should add this information to the guide.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2008, 04:25:32 am by Hendrich »

Archangel

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #37 on: August 13, 2008, 04:33:04 am »
com_hunkMegs is what you're looking for -- not sure why you'd want to change it though. Trem doesn't need special "codes" to use your dual core processor, just run the SMP client if you really want to use both cores. I've heard it's unstable, though.

Taiyo.uk

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #38 on: August 13, 2008, 06:08:31 am »
just run the SMP client if you really want to use both cores.
Which SMP client is this you speak of?

Archangel

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #39 on: August 13, 2008, 06:10:35 am »
If you compile by source, there's a flag to compile an SMP client.
http://trem-servers.com/index.php?page=downloads

Annihilation

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #40 on: August 13, 2008, 06:33:44 am »
Wow, thx! I'll keep up the good work, its nice to know soemone out there is appreciates my work, I'll keep it up for people like you.  ;D

I'm also updating the guide again. :P

PS: To tell you the truth, I thought the guide I made really sucked. :P

All the guides that Powa will eventually add to our Guild thread that I made will probably suck, but I have the courage to post them, just like you.  But seriously, this guide is excellent.  I didn't understand the half of it, but what really got to me was the thoroughness and sincerity of it. 

Again, keep up the good work!

Psttt thats when you invite him to apply to Void.   

*wink wink*

 ;)
[11:33:20 PM] Kaine:
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kevlarman

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #41 on: August 13, 2008, 07:17:14 am »
If you compile by source, there's a flag to compile an SMP client.
http://trem-servers.com/index.php?page=downloads
and that flag is ignored outside OS X because it doesn't actually do anything on the other systems (but supposedly sdl 1.3 is supposed to fix this)
Quote from: Asvarox link=topic=8622.msg169333#msg169333
Ok let's plan it out. Asva, you are nub, go sit on rets, I will build, you two go feed like hell, you go pwn their asses, and everyone else camp in the hallway, roger?
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daenyth

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #42 on: August 13, 2008, 06:54:23 pm »
Quote
A nice howto on cleaning up windows. You neglect, though, to mention anything about how video games impact performance

Sorry, but, wtf? The point of this guide was to increase performance on tremulous, so of course we all know playing tremulous does impact performance of the computer, duh, thats why I made this. If video games didn't impact performance, then obviously Tremulous would run faster. Whats the point of telling everyone Tremulous slows down your computer, because thats what everyone expects, explosions, lag and 3D models.

Sorry, that was my mistake. I meant to say "video card", not "video game".

If you compile by source, there's a flag to compile an SMP client.
http://trem-servers.com/index.php?page=downloads
and that flag is ignored outside OS X because it doesn't actually do anything on the other systems (but supposedly sdl 1.3 is supposed to fix this)

Damn, it doesn't? What a ripoff :P
Fix it!

-

Now, in an effort to be constructive, here's a Linux tip: Start it in another display. This has a few benefits; one  is that your DE/WM won't be doing anything, so it saves some resources there, and another big one is that you will never, ever be interrupted by something popping up. It allows you to play fullscreen and switch around to your main things easily. You can use the following script:

Code: [Select]
#!/bin/bash
xinit /absolute/path/to/trem.x86 $* -- :1
# :1 would be on vc/8, :0 is vc/7 (The default). If you want it on another vc, just increment the display number
# You may need to use xauth to allow your user to access the other display, depending how your system is configured.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2008, 07:00:18 pm by daenyth »
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Hendrich

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #43 on: August 13, 2008, 09:02:06 pm »
Quote
com_hunkMegs is what you're looking for -- not sure why you'd want to change it though. Trem doesn't need special "codes" to use your dual core processor, just run the SMP client if you really want to use both cores. I've heard it's unstable, though.

Daum, you beat me to the awnser, just when I got it. :P
Well add in com_hunkMegs cactusfrog and add in how many megabytes you want Tremulous to use. Don't put too many in though, I'll reccommend 40-75% of your RAM, 75% maximum, but if your like me, don't touch it. You most likely will f*** up on it, and Trem will crash.

Quote
SMP client

Sorry, never heard of such a thing. Please explain further if it is useful, but I'm guessing using a SMP client is a peice of puppy do-do if everyone doesn't have dual/quad/whatever proccessors.

Quote
Psttt thats when you invite him to apply to Void.   
*wink wink*

You like me to apply to a vaccum of dark matter wheres theres no existence of space or time?
 :P <-- *Brain Malfunction*

Hey people, the guide reached over 600 veiws!  ;D

And someone gave me a -1 on my Karma mark, I always wondered why do people do that? Doesn't that tick anybody off?
« Last Edit: August 14, 2008, 02:35:45 am by Hendrich »

David

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #44 on: August 13, 2008, 09:39:14 pm »
Well add in com_hunkMegs cactusfrog and add in how many megabytes you want Tremulous to use. Don't put too many in though, I'll reccommend 40-75% of your RAM, 75% maximum.

Don't touch it.
If you set it too low, trem will crash, and if its bigger than it needs to be it will jut tie-up ram that could be used elsewhere and slow the system down.
ditto zoneMegs.
Any maps not in the MG repo?  Email me or come to irc.freenode.net/#mg.
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I am not a dev.  Nothing I say counts for anything.

cactusfrog

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #45 on: August 14, 2008, 09:46:48 am »
ok will not touch! Any codes to speed up tremed.exe because my sever is ulimitedbp and i want to make it as unlaggy as possible. 

David

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #46 on: August 14, 2008, 12:38:38 pm »
Set the build points back to default.
It was never designed to handle such things, and as such doesn't do a good job of it.
That or get a real net connection and ram up all the net settings.  (And tell clients to do the same)
Any maps not in the MG repo?  Email me or come to irc.freenode.net/#mg.
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I'm disappointed that people's past actions have forced me to state what should be obvious.
I am not a dev.  Nothing I say counts for anything.

Lava Croft

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #47 on: August 14, 2008, 12:47:29 pm »
+set com_zonemegs 24 +set com_hunkmegs 256 is what I have been using since forever.

rotacak

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2008, 02:25:46 am »
Quote
And someone gave me a -1 on my Karma mark, I always wondered why do people do that?
Because they can. If you don't say "You have right and I agree with you" to everyone, then you will have karma very low :-)

Lakitu7

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2008, 03:26:43 am »
I suppose that as one of the few techie guys around here that primarily runs Windows I should weigh in. For qualifications, I think it's sufficient to say that this XP install has lasted for circa 5 years now without an issue (No, if you don't suck you don't have to reformat Windows once a month), and that I reguarly achieve 1.5-2 months of heavy, heavy use without needing to reboot.

I'm impressed that this guide didn't fall into the usual trap of recommending 500 "tweaks" that are, primarily, snake-oil if not outright harmful (BlackViper guide, I'm looking at you).

In XP, you should keep Virtual Memory on. Your system won't use it until you're almost full on real-RAM anyway. If you turn it off and your system needs some more memory, things will just close. Further, many apps (Photoshop, to name one that's rather common) were written with swap-space in mind and do not function with the swapfile turned off. So, DO leave it on. Turning it off is much more likely to hurt you than help. However, the advice to set it to a constant size of something like 1.5-2x your physical RAM is correct. The setting to "automatically manage" is just a recipe for fragmentation. One tip that DOES help a little bit with virtual memory is to split it across different physical drives if you have them. Reading a large thing from swap that's stored on 2 drives will happen faster: twice the max access speed. :)

In Vista, the OS is more aggressive with using physical RAM and even less aggressive with use of disk cache than XP was. There's even less reason to disable disk cache in Vista. Yes, Vista's aggressive use of physical RAM makes people say "omg it uses so much memory" but that's because they're idiots who listened to OS zealots instead of trying to read how things work. The "extra" memory is prefetch and will be freed as soon as something needs it.

If you're running NTFS, and you really should be on your system drive, defragmenting is really unlikely to make a performance difference.


But yes, by-and-large, this guide has the right idea to not screwing up Windows: Don't do stupid things and don't listen when people tell you to do stupid things. Don't install programs that "MAKE YOUR COMPUTER RUN FASTER" or blindly apply "tweaks" that claim to do the same thing.

If you want your computer to run faster and Trem to load faster, buy another stick of RAM. You can buy 2 gigs of DDR2 in a good brand for $40.

Hendrich

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #50 on: August 16, 2008, 08:48:26 pm »
Nice information Lakitu7! It's so good, I'm adding it to the guide. :P
« Last Edit: August 16, 2008, 08:58:42 pm by Hendrich »

rotacak

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2008, 06:30:25 pm »
(Photoshop, to name one that's rather common) were written with swap-space in mind and do not function with the swapfile turned off. So, DO leave it on. Turning it off is much more likely to hurt you than help.
That is not true. My Photoshop only show dialog window with message something like that "You have VM turned off, this brings zero performace more etc. You want run PS now?". Then PS work normally.

But with swap ON is system more slow. Because swap is used even if you have enough RAM. I have to wait when firefox with 10 tabs closing, PS with pictures take time to close etc. With swap OFF is all immediately. Click = program closed. I not found any program what not working with swap OFF. And now I really don't want slow down my old computer by turning swap ON.

But it's logical when you fill memory, then you can't run more programs. That happen to me only when I playing game "Fiesta online". This game work weird with memory.

Lakitu7

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #52 on: August 18, 2008, 09:57:27 pm »
That is not true. My Photoshop only show dialog window with message something like that "You have VM turned off, this brings zero performace more etc. You want run PS now?". Then PS work normally.

But with swap ON is system more slow. Because swap is used even if you have enough RAM. I have to wait when firefox with 10 tabs closing, PS with pictures take time to close etc. With swap OFF is all immediately. Click = program closed. I not found any program what not working with swap OFF. And now I really don't want slow down my old computer by turning swap ON.

But it's logical when you fill memory, then you can't run more programs. That happen to me only when I playing game "Fiesta online". This game work weird with memory.

Photoshop depends on version, then. Earlier ones do as I say.

If Firefox is paging out, then you had it minimized for a long time and then sat the computer idle. The system pages out things that are minimized and idle for a long time so that starting new things will happen more quickly. This particular behavior is decreased/removed in Vista, but still exists in XP. It's the only possible point of contention for turning off swap in XP, but overall the pros outweigh the cons, generally. Most of your observed effect is the result of Firefox leaking memory like nobody's business. I'm not sure how much changing windows to compensate for failures in Firefox is really good advice.

Overall it fails the usual test: Do you know more about Windows than Microsoft does? Probably not. :) I'm inclined to think Adobe knows more about Photoshop than you do, as well.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2008, 10:00:38 pm by Lakitu7 »

rotacak

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #53 on: August 18, 2008, 10:10:50 pm »
Well, I not need know anything about MS or PS. I only see my system speed with swap on and swap off. And swap off is faster for me :-)

Bissig

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #54 on: August 18, 2008, 11:10:18 pm »
Microsoft doesn't seem to know much about their own products considering there are exploits/bugs still not fixed after many, many years. Also, why should loading something twice be faster then loading it once? HDD -> RAM -> SWAP -> RAM -> SWAP -> RAM -> ad infinitum

player1

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster: Mac?
« Reply #55 on: August 19, 2008, 03:11:18 am »
If you compile by source, there's a flag to compile an SMP client.
http://trem-servers.com/index.php?page=downloads
and that flag is ignored outside OS X because it doesn't actually do anything on the other systems (but supposedly sdl 1.3 is supposed to fix this)

Do you guys know if anybody but Zorb over at Beer Garden ever took advantage of that? Does the stock Mac client utilize Symmetric Multiprocessing? Here's a link to the thread in which it was discussed, many moons ago. I never actually DL'd it, but CompSU (remember that dude?) said it was quite a bit faster. I don't know diddly about it, but since this thread is called "How to make Trem run faster" w/o mentioning any specific OS, I thought it might be interesting to Mac users, and to the OP, since Hendrich sounds pretty open to hearing about any helpful or useful hints. Maybe kev or one of the other knowledgeable folks can provide more information. Apparently SMP would enable both cores to run Trem, side-by-side. Someone mentioned above that it wouldn't be useful for other operating systems besides Mac, since a variety of hardware exists; for Mac users however, I believe that most of the recent machines are dual-core (or better), so it could potentially be very useful. I don't see any tweaks for Mac here, except for the very obvious get more RAM suggestion, which helped me immensely. A fine thread; big ups for starting it. :)

Thanks to anyone who can add more. Cheers!

tuple

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #56 on: August 19, 2008, 01:33:16 pm »
If you're running NTFS, and you really should be on your system drive, defragmenting is really unlikely to make a performance difference.

Defraging NTFS won't make trem run faster, however depending on how fragmented your drive is, it could greatly improve load times.  Additionally, if your page file has been set to autogrow for a while, it too can become fragmented.  The only way to fix that is to remove the page file, defrag as much as possible, the recreate the page file at a set size.  My only thought in this is that a lot of the younger folks playing trem may have downloaded large zip files/ISOs etc, (ala pirates bay) and could have a pretty heavily fragmented drive.  WARNING  if your computer has a fragmented page file, there's a good chance you need that page file.  Removing it and rebooting (which will be required) may cause extremely painful slowdowns until the page file is recreated, assuming your computer successfully boots.

What may help is to check for running processes in memory using the task manager.  Lots of programs leave little helpers behind that are ultimately pointless and stupid, doing little else than checking for an update once a day or less.  Some of the culprits are java, adobe acrobat, adaware, some zip programs, etc.  I haven't used windows in a while so I don't recall any more, though I used to run into tons of them.  If your machine is squeezed for memory, the little amount freed by stopping/killing these programs may make a considerable difference.  If there are many of them, the amount of memory they consume may be substantial.  Running msconfig from the run dialog comes to mind.  I seem to recall that as the name of the program that will simplify locating programs that are run at boot time.

For more advanced users, I'd also recommend checking your system services.  Turn off and/or disable any that aren't needed.  But I warn you, MS seems to intentionally obfuscates their service names and does not do a good job of defining what they do, so if you don't know what a service does don't touch it.  Or at least remember the services you changed and be prepared to change them back.  I've seen windows systems do strange things when seemingly (completely) unrelated services are disabled, prepare yourself to reenable them if you run into weirdness.  I'm reminded of a win2000 box that failed making VPN connections when a service that appeared (by name and MS web site) to have nothing to do with VPNs, encryption, tunnels, etc was turned off.

All of this is really just an end run around the real performance enhancer, in case you are for some reason unable to do it:
The single most effective performance enhancement has always been, in my experience, to add memory.  If your GPU is the issue, memory may not help, for all other things it will.  Scavenge old machines, talk to friends or family, they may have an old computer sitting unused that has the same type of memory that your system uses.  You'd be surprised where you can find memory if you ask around and/or keep you eyes open for it.  Its not as easy as it used to be (which was VERY) as there are many different types of ram these days, its still worth it though.

khalsa

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #57 on: August 19, 2008, 04:18:08 pm »
I've been told this works well: http://www.theorica.net/gamexp.htm


Khalsa
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kevlarman

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster: Mac?
« Reply #58 on: August 19, 2008, 10:35:32 pm »
If you compile by source, there's a flag to compile an SMP client.
http://trem-servers.com/index.php?page=downloads
and that flag is ignored outside OS X because it doesn't actually do anything on the other systems (but supposedly sdl 1.3 is supposed to fix this)

Do you guys know if anybody but Zorb over at Beer Garden ever took advantage of that? Does the stock Mac client utilize Symmetric Multiprocessing? Here's a link to the thread in which it was discussed, many moons ago. I never actually DL'd it, but CompSU (remember that dude?) said it was quite a bit faster. I don't know diddly about it, but since this thread is called "How to make Trem run faster" w/o mentioning any specific OS, I thought it might be interesting to Mac users, and to the OP, since Hendrich sounds pretty open to hearing about any helpful or useful hints. Maybe kev or one of the other knowledgeable folks can provide more information. Apparently SMP would enable both cores to run Trem, side-by-side. Someone mentioned above that it wouldn't be useful for other operating systems besides Mac, since a variety of hardware exists; for Mac users however, I believe that most of the recent machines are dual-core (or better), so it could potentially be very useful. I don't see any tweaks for Mac here, except for the very obvious get more RAM suggestion, which helped me immensely. A fine thread; big ups for starting it. :)

Thanks to anyone who can add more. Cheers!
tjw's original mac client had smp support afaik, simply hacking in the mac smp support does very little to help fps with other oses though.
Quote from: Asvarox link=topic=8622.msg169333#msg169333
Ok let's plan it out. Asva, you are nub, go sit on rets, I will build, you two go feed like hell, you go pwn their asses, and everyone else camp in the hallway, roger?
the dretch bites.
-----
|..d| #
|.@.-##
-----

Hendrich

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Re: How To Make Tremulous Run Faster- A Guide
« Reply #59 on: August 20, 2008, 12:06:58 am »
I'm adding Tuple's reply to the guide, nice information Tuple! but do please explain what NTFS means. :P

Its nice to see people are actually talking how to improve performance of tremulous (The conversations are mostly about Swaping, I gotta add that to the guide.), usually I don't see much of that here in the fourms. But then again, I didn't see every single topic in the fourms, so yea.

Power to the players! XD
« Last Edit: August 20, 2008, 12:09:25 am by Hendrich »