Credits/Evos economy

[Roanoke]

I think that it would be cool if the team shared the credits/evos. Each time you buy something, you go into debt, and each time you sell/kill something, you pay back some debt. You can't buy while in debt, or buy something that will put you in debt. I think this will allow more people to afford more current equipment, and discourage feeding.

[Hendrich]

Another idea? Damn, you're on a roll this week. 

Anyways, I don't see whats wrong with the current credit/evo system, as this idea seems complicated. I mean, if you kill, something, you put credits/evos into the so called "bank" for everyone to use, I understand that. But this is confusing:

Each time you buy something, you go into debt

You can't buy......something that will put you in debt

So, whats the point?

Also, can't I just buy a b-suit and a Lucifer all I want as long as theres money to be taken? Tha seems pretty unfair to the other teammates. I think I can manage my own money, thank you very much.   


So please, re-think this idea and give us a more refined one. Because what I'm reading right now seems to be just, meh.

[Roanoke]

Here is an example of what I mean, as I find this hard to explain otherwise. Let's say I want to by a helm. I have killed two dretches, which means I contributed to the group about 300 creds. My debt is -300 creds. Now I buy the helmet. My debt becomes -210 creds, and the group loses 90 creds. I can sell my helmet, which means I get 90 subtracted from my debt, and the group gains 90 creds. Killing aliens is similar: debt is lowered, group earns creds.
Now take another example. I have a debt of -1 creds. I can buy the helmet, but that will make my debt 89 creds. However, I am allowed to do this, as the helmet is not a weapon. It is not permitted to buy a weapon that will send me into debt. I can also request some creds from the pool, and a percentage of what I request will be added to my debt. Because I am now better equipped, I can go kill some aliens and reduce my debt.
Is it more understandable now?

[Hendrich]

So, I can only get stuff from my teammate's credit pool as long as its not a weapon, like armour, jetpacks, etc. If so, I cannot get the weapon if it will get me in debt. Is, that what you mean?

Wow, I like it, but this only seems to affect getting armour. Also, make it so if you took a jetpack/etc but you died afterwards, every single credit you gain from something (Kill, Gained from the time you wait, etc) has to go in paying that debt. So you can't gain any more credits to buy newer weapons until you pay off that debt. Also, make it so if you owe something like over 500 credits, you won't be allowed to take anymore money from the pool anymore.

I can also request some creds from the pool, and a percentage of what I request will be added to my debt. Because I am now better equipped.

Can't I just take 2000 credits, and I owe 40% of it, but I can keep losing the 2000 by dying and even if I paid back the debt, I would give back less credits then I had taken.

Ok, give me your feedback if I'm understanding this idea, as right now I'm trying to figure out whether this idea can do more use then harm. 

[Roanoke]

No, you can buy weapons, just as long as your debt won't be positive. The only thing that you can buy that will/could land you in debt is armor. I guess there should be a max withdrawal-per-life, as even a lucisuit only costs 1000 creds, plus a nade is 1200 creds, but  you can kill some aliens and buy a nade. As for percentages, that's a good point, so 100% of what you requested should be your debt.

[Hendrich]

As for percentages, that's a good point, so 100% of what you requested should be your debt.

Or maybe to spice it up a notch, 15-% is your debt. Like, if you take 1000 ccredits, you now owe 1500 credits, so in other words, if you fuck up, YOU FUCK UP. So maybe feeders would be a little more aware of what they need or not need.

No, you can buy weapons, just as long as your debt won't be positive.

Ah, I see now.

Also, why not add the idea of a player required to pay a 10 credit debt for every death he/she takes? But its multiplied by 2 for every death you take, The multiplier only takes place when you die repeatedly within, lets say, 3 minutes of somewhere in the game. This can get feeders to stop feeding or else within a few debts, they won't be able to earn any more credits for their own.

guess there should be a max withdrawal-per-life

True, but I rather go with the limit of how much credits you can take. If I was in a situation where I needed credits but I had a maximum of 5 withdrals per life, I would just cash in of what I currently have and suicide. XD

I see your idea now Roanoke, so lets re-cap:


Basic Premise:
This "Mod idea" replaces the default (and probably simpler) buying system for Tremulous with an economy-based element. This mod intends to do the following:

-Add in an interesting "economy" element in the game, so you can be more connected to your teammates.
-Makes feeders think twice of feeding, and essentially stopping feeders in their tracks
-You can actually contribute to the success of your team by you yourself being successful. If you aren't successful at killing though, you'll be letting your team down.

How it works:

Both Teams:
-Both teams has a "Economy Pool" (EP).
-This pool is used for containing gained credits or evos during battle by the teammates of both sides.
-The EP is shown at [Insert wherever the fuck you want it to be].
-You can contribute to the pool by killing an enemy.
-You can take away credits/evos from the pool when buying skills/upgrades/classes from it.
-For every kill you get, you gain an amount called a Decrasing Economy Buying Table, or DEBT, for short. 
-Theres two kinds of DEBT, positive DEBT and negitive DEBT.
-You gain positive DEBT from earning evos/credits into the pool.
-You gain negitive DEBT when you die or use the Economy Pool.
-You can see how much DEBT you have in a small screen [Insert wherever the fuck you want it to be].
-If your DEBT is in the negatives, then you owe your team (EP) credits/evos.
-If not, then you're fine and you can take as much credits/evos as you want, as long as your debt is still positive.
-You can "borrow" as much credits/evos as you need. If you're a human, you can't take a weapon that can drag your total DEBT into the negatives, but you can take armor/upgrades that can drag your total DEBT into the negatives, but you'll have to owe 150% of what you took back onto the EP. For aliens, you can only take up to 5 evos, and for every evo you take, you have one negitive DEBT on your account.
-When you have Positive DEBT (PD), you can spend as much stuff as you want with it, as its technically your money you're using, only in two conditions:
1) The EP has enough credits/evos for your request
2) You don't have any negitive DEBT that drags your total DEBT into the negatives.

So yea, I guess thats that. I officially give this my "Some Serious Shit Going On" stamp, as it doesn't look noob friendly.
I blame you Roanoke. XD

[UniqPhoeniX]

It wont work in case there is one very good player earning a lot of evos/creds, because the newbs can't use it. And aliens don't have upgrades.

[Hendrich]

It wont work in case there is one very good player earning a lot of evos/creds, because the newbs can't use it. And aliens don't have upgrades.

I remember writing my previous post afer coming back from work at 1:00 in the morning, uggggh, my head wasn't straight.
Anyways, you're right. Maybe you can give us a suggestion on how to fix that problem, as I need some sleep from last night. -.-

[Roanoke]

guess there should be a max withdrawal-per-life

True, but I rather go with the limit of how much credits you can take. If I was in a situation where I needed credits but I had a maximum of 5 withdrals per life, I would just cash in of what I currently have and suicide. XD

Yes, that's what I meant.

words about debt

Almost, except negative debt is good and positive debt is bad. Like real debt, it's like owing -$10 to someone.

It wont work in case there is one very good player earning a lot of evos/creds, because the newbs can't use it. And aliens don't have upgrades.

Well, it will require some guidance for the n00bs. But they should RTFM.
As for upgrades in aliens, you can always evolve, even if you get into debt, because evolving is like buying armor.

[Ellohir]

The standart + donate is the best. This is too complicated and doesn't bring any real good advantage.

[Roanoke]

It enables a team to get newer equipment faster and prevents feeding.

[snb]

Hate the idea. It is to much like democrats, that was my hard earned money, and they took it away (Im a republican by the way).  Now a refined idea is that you can chose to put money there like by using the donate key, or there could be some kind of tax that would move money into this bank OR when we have too much money (say you have 2000 creds but you kill a dretch, how ever much that dretch costs goes into the bank). The easiest ones to implement are the "too much money" and "Donate."

[Bissig]

Hate the idea. It is to much like democrats, that was my hard earned money, and they took it away (Im a republican by the way).  Now a refined idea is that you can chose to put money there like by using the donate key, or there could be some kind of tax that would move money into this bank OR when we have too much money (say you have 2000 creds but you kill a dretch, how ever much that dretch costs goes into the bank). The easiest ones to implement are the "too much money" and "Donate."

So, that's why you don't use your brain...

[Roanoke]

'They took it away'? come on, trem is a team game. You can't afford selfishness and being a lucisuit while half your team is running around as naked riflemen. I have only seen the donate function used occasionally, and it's only available on certain servers.

[Urcscumug]

If share is disabled on the server you can't help it, but otherwise most people forget/don't know it's there. I have binds for donating 50/100/200 credits but it also helps if teammates actually remember to say "please donate".