turrets are WAY to useless in 1.2 (edited)

[SirDude]

i feel that building super spread out bases is almost like the 1.1 turtle bases of 1.1, you know, in 1.1 the only bases that lasted were the compact turtle bases, and in GPP the only ones that last are the spread out kind, same kind of build concepts, just on different end of the extreme, I if feel that a mix of the 2 should be a option on most maps. IE maybe a few rets clumped to next to each other in key points to deal corner snipers or RC hops, but some spread out for general defenses that cant zapped.

turrets are how do i put this,
USELESS! (in a certain way)
its mainly that windup, its WAY too long as a good goon can bounce back and forth using its pounce doing major damage to them and almost never got shot, and the mara, this is a no brainier, just creep around the corner and zap, then run, again and again, and they will have no base- forcing you to build open airy bases that are just like the 1.1 bases but on the other extreme.


i say we one of the best ways we can fix this is to add a buildable that makes up for that wind up time that you get in S2, it SHOULD be very expensive, and you might only be able to squeeze out 2 in a base.

im thinking of a lassgun turret, its that same as a normal turret but a wee bit tougher and ZERO wind up time. its firing distance should be a wee bit farther too, and of course it costs 12 bp so its something that's made to support your turrets but not be your main defense.

I think S2 would be a good spot to get it as that's when aliens become great base killers as the humans base
doesn't get a upgrade till S3.


also i have to say i think Teslas could absorb the maras zap and not spread it to other buildings, as this might have the same afect as a lass gun ret (it might still takes the damage tho, but maybe 25% more or 25% less, i can't think of which one would work out best)

i feel that in both 1.1 and GPP both have a devolved a "build this way or die" mindset to them, no room for mixing and that can easily discourage newer builders who don't get it at first.
that's what my turret idea is for, it a allows a mix of the 2 build styles but doesn't change how how the gameplay as a whole as much as a value change can.

Edited for better understanding/newer mindset.

please post constructive criticism.

[Celestial_Rage]

Turret Windup: It is all about placement. The point of those turrets is so that aliens can get into your base and get a kill or two if humans are camping hard. Furthermore, if you place the turrets correctly, the aliens shouldn't be able to get any damage on you at all. Further, if you're having trouble with goons pouncing your turrets, perhaps reconsider your turret placement strategy.

As for your idea for Tesla Generators absorbing mara zap: That could prove to be very interesting. It would call for more strategic tesla placement.

Lasgun Turret: No, turrets do tremendous damage as it is when locked.

[CorSair]

Turret Windup: It is all about placement. The point of those turrets is so that aliens can get into your base and get a kill or two if humans are camping hard. Furthermore, if you place the turrets correctly, the aliens shouldn't be able to get any damage on you at all. Further, if you're having trouble with goons pouncing your turrets, perhaps reconsider your turret placement strategy.

I echo this one. My tactic on turret building; put it far away from entry point corners, and put turrets in conjunction, so they can cover each other. 3 Turrets on same conjunction, they should shred adv. marauder in no time, or least, 1 turret destroyed, and adv. marauder badly hurt.
And it's all about strategical placement, nothing more.

But that Tesla absorbing zap, can be little... unbalanced. Good idea though. And to think more, more tesla generators you got, the more of damage you can absorb, thus dividing the damage done to all teslas in same zone of adv marauders zap. But just an idea.

[SirDude]

Turret Windup: It is all about placement. The point of those turrets is so that aliens can get into your base and get a kill or two if humans are camping hard. Furthermore, if you place the turrets correctly, the aliens shouldn't be able to get any damage on you at all. Further, if you're having trouble with goons pouncing your turrets, perhaps reconsider your turret placement strategy.

As for your idea for Tesla Generators absorbing mara zap: That could prove to be very interesting. It would call for more strategic tesla placement.

Lasgun Turret: No, turrets do tremendous damage as it is when locked.

if humans are camping hard, isnt it already hard to beat?
after i warm up, i can easy get in a base and get 2 or 3 kills even with a great base, and that can be all that is need for s2, and then when aliens become deadlier to your base as they have avd goon and avd mara now.


as for the lasgun ret, it has the rate of fire of a normal lasgun, i HIGHLY doubt that the lasgun does more damage then them, if so...

[Meisseli]

Make turrets cover each other so that when a goon tries to pounce one it gets hit by three turrets.

[OhaiReapd]

Turrets need no change. I find the change welcome. The turrets are stronger but with a longer charge time. This is fair, considering an auto turret would not be a Stage 1 buildable. I also find it more balanced towards aliens, considering this makes it so good aliens can take out 3-4 turrets if no one is hitting them with another weapon. This makes humans build a more thought out base, and make it so they can't camp the entire game. All in all, I believe it needs no changes at all.

[swamp-cecil]

turrets are how do i put this,
USELESS!
its mainly that windup, its WAY too long as a good goon can bounce back and forth using its pounce doing major damage to them and almost never got shot, and the mara, this is a no brainier, just creep around the corner and zap, then run, again and again, and they will have no base.

Turrets are not unuseful. dretches cant stand a chance about them.
mara CAN walk around it while zapping, but thats why you make more than one turret
goon will get shot when pouncing at it and running back. like i said.make more turrets
i say we one of the best ways we can fix this is to add a buildable that makes up for that wind up time that you get in S2, it SHOULD be very expensive, and you might only be able to squeeze out 2 in a base.

im thinking of a lassgun turret, its that same as a normal turret but a wee bit tougher and ZERO wind up time. its firing distance should be a wee bit farther too, and of course it costs 12 bp so its something that's made to support your turrets but not be your main defense.

maybe name should be plasma turret.
more than 12 BP. well, maybe.
I think S2 would be a good spot to get it as that's when aliens become great base killers as the humans base
doesn't get a upgrade till S3.
o
a dretch is the aliens basic offence unit. It cant kill turrets. on the other hand, riflers can easily destry acids when not backed up
thats because humans camp. They attack when ready

also i have to say i think Teslas should absorb the maras zap and not spread it to other buildings (it still takes the damage tho, but maybe 25% more or 25% less, i can't think of which one would work out best)

i think no, because then humans would spam teslas around the RC if a mara RC hops so that the rc wont take take damage

please post constructive criticism.

[SirDude]

turrets are how do i put this,
USELESS!
its mainly that windup, its WAY too long as a good goon can bounce back and forth using its pounce doing major damage to them and almost never got shot, and the mara, this is a no brainier, just creep around the corner and zap, then run, again and again, and they will have no base.

Turrets are not unuseful. dretches cant stand a chance about them.
mara CAN walk around it while zapping, but thats why you make more than one turret
goon will get shot when pouncing at it and running back. like i said.make more turrets
really, you think im only using ONE turret/really?
i say we one of the best ways we can fix this is to add a buildable that makes up for that wind up time that you get in S2, it SHOULD be very expensive, and you might only be able to squeeze out 2 in a base.

im thinking of a lassgun turret, its that same as a normal turret but a wee bit tougher and ZERO wind up time. its firing distance should be a wee bit farther too, and of course it costs 12 bp so its something that's made to support your turrets but not be your main defense.

maybe name should be plasma turret.
more than 12 BP. well, maybe.
wat
I think S2 would be a good spot to get it as that's when aliens become great base killers as the humans base
doesn't get a upgrade till S3.
o
a dretch is the aliens basic offence unit. It cant kill turrets. on the other hand, riflers can easily destry acids when not backed up
thats because humans camp. They attack when ready
if your rushing a base with a dretch, your not doing it to damage the base, your doing it for the kills.

also i have to say i think Teslas should absorb the maras zap and not spread it to other buildings (it still takes the damage tho, but maybe 25% more or 25% less, i can't think of which one would work out best)

i think no, because then humans would spam teslas around the RC if a mara RC hops so that the rc wont take take damage
im not saying that the zap will target the telsas first, as the zap targets the closest object onscreen so a RC hop will still work, making it something you use on corners so a mara that just eaks around the corner and zaps won't destroy the whole base

please post constructive criticism.

[Tremulant]

If your bases are falling to opportunistic single maras and goons then you need to rethink your building strategy, if your base is being killed by a concerted rush, well, alien bases go the same way in response to a good human rush, that's kinda the point, bases aren't supposed to be perfectly impenetrable. The new turrets, when well placed, are a hell of a lot deadlier than the old ones.

[SirDude]

this is in mainly smaller matches, like 4v4 or 2v2 and so on where a vast majority of players must leave the base for a successful rush, aliens don't really need numbers to do a good rush, a mara can easily kill a whole base in moments, that's when things like this come in to play, it makes aliens require more then a mara or a goons to kill a base.

and like i said they meant to support your turrets by placing then in very key points to help deal with things like this, and because they are so expensive they must be used wisely, thus not being OP or unbalancing.

[Celestial_Rage]

Yeah, but why make a new turret? Turrets can support turrets. You don't need a brand new turret to support another.

[SirDude]

because they all have windup time, i think building in this game (humans) should be a bit more then building placement.

[SlackerLinux]

because they all have windup time, i think building in this game (humans) should be a bit more then building placement.

Tesla gens have no windup and 1-2 at key spots can disorientate maras that want to zap giving turrets enough time to lock on its a matter of knowing how to build turrets are not meant to do all the work players and other base defense structures(like the tesla) play a role too

[jm82792]

Turret Windup: It is all about placement. The point of those turrets is so that aliens can get into your base and get a kill or two if humans are camping hard. Furthermore, if you place the turrets correctly, the aliens shouldn't be able to get any damage on you at all. Further, if you're having trouble with goons pouncing your turrets, perhaps reconsider your turret placement strategy.

As for your idea for Tesla Generators absorbing mara zap: That could prove to be very interesting. It would call for more strategic tesla placement.

Lasgun Turret: No, turrets do tremendous damage as it is when locked.

Place turrets in the correct spots and they work.
Cluster them and you fail.

[Lecavalier]

I'm a bad builder and my bases get pwned 

That's cool, but you don't have to make a thread about it. Just ask for assisstance. Here is a very good guide on human building to help you out.

[swamp-cecil]

this is in mainly smaller matches, like 4v4 or 2v2 and so on where a vast majority of players must leave the base for a successful rush, aliens don't really need numbers to do a good rush, a mara can easily kill a whole base in moments, that's when things like this come in to play, it makes aliens require more then a mara or a goons to kill a base.

and like i said they meant to support your turrets by placing then in very key points to help deal with things like this, and because they are so expensive they must be used wisely, thus not being OP or unbalancing.

heres a diagram:  +  = the alien version of (i belive all of you have seen this)  (painsaw) + 

technically, the RC mara rush is the same as the OM painsaw rush, where the painsawer has more chance to live and the mara would usually get killed, but damage more structurs, which can mark the beginning of a good rush.

[SirDude]

SirDude is a known greifer.

I'm a bad builder and my bases get pwned 

That's cool, but you don't have to make a thread about it. Just ask for assisstance. Here is a very good guide on human building to help you out.

don't you just love the warmth of a good flame?

this is in mainly smaller matches, like 4v4 or 2v2 and so on where a vast majority of players must leave the base for a successful rush, aliens don't really need numbers to do a good rush, a mara can easily kill a whole base in moments, that's when things like this come in to play, it makes aliens require more then a mara or a goons to kill a base.

and like i said they meant to support your turrets by placing then in very key points to help deal with things like this, and because they are so expensive they must be used wisely, thus not being OP or unbalancing.

heres a diagram:  +  = the alien version of (i belive all of you have seen this)  (painsaw) + 

technically, the RC mara rush is the same as the OM painsaw rush, where the painsawer has more chance to live and the mara would usually get killed, but damage more structurs, which can mark the beginning of a good rush.

well 1 you get mara s2 and Battle suit in s3 there a good change of in the s3 vs s2 game play wise.
2nd the painsaw rush almost ALWAYS dies in S3 due to rants and such, but the mara can RUN and run he will, i cant tell you how many bases ive killed with just a mara.

[A Spork]

BSuit may be s3, but if I'm Psaw rushing I always Larmor + helm for radar and agility and silence.
And I can't tell you how many times I've destroyed the om at s3 with a nade and a couple seconds of sawing

[SirDude]

SirDude is a known greifer.

/callvote ban sirdude over9000d
SirDude is a known deconner, F1

careful do want that nice flame to turn into a forest fire.

BSuit may be s3, but if I'm Psaw rushing I always Larmor + helm for radar and agility and silence.
And I can't tell you how many times I've destroyed the om at s3 with a nade and a couple seconds of sawing

well one if you can do that in late S3, then the aliens have a bad base and no defenders.
i cant tell you how many psaw rushers ive kill...

[A Spork]

The trick is rush when the aliens are busy with a luci or somthing.
That, and dancing.

[SirDude]

The trick is rush when the aliens are busy with a luci or somthing.
That, and dancing.

heres the thing, with a Psaw you have to get INSIDE the base and most alien bases have a large portion of their defenses on and around the entrances to prevent you from getting in and a good amount of defenses are just to prevent a OM rush like that., but with a mara you dont even need to get in the range of a tesla to shock the ENTIRE base.

[Tremulant]

i cant tell you how many bases ive killed with just a mara.

Judging by your tremstats i'd say around 0.3

[swamp-cecil]

The trick is rush when the aliens are busy with a luci or somthing.
That, and dancing.

heres the thing, with a Psaw you have to get INSIDE the base and most alien bases have a large portion of their defenses on and around the entrances to prevent you from getting in and a good amount of defenses are just to prevent a OM rush like that., but with a mara you dont even need to get in the range of a tesla to shock the ENTIRE base.

yeah...getting shot with 5 riflers and 6 rets and the RC at the same time isnt enough damage.

[SirDude]

i cant tell you how many bases ive killed with just a mara.

Judging by your tremstats i'd say around 0.3

i have reinstalled trem many times so moot point, and tremstats don't define your skill.

The trick is rush when the aliens are busy with a luci or somthing.
That, and dancing.

heres the thing, with a Psaw you have to get INSIDE the base and most alien bases have a large portion of their defenses on and around the entrances to prevent you from getting in and a good amount of defenses are just to prevent a OM rush like that., but with a mara you dont even need to get in the range of a tesla to shock the ENTIRE base.

yeah...getting shot with 5 riflers and 6 rets and the RC at the same time isnt enough damage.

oh yea blindly walking in to human base to zap is how i do it, none of that guerrilla warfare, hit and run tactics...

Double chain zap... all the way OMG, what does it mean?

[Tremulant]

i cant tell you how many bases ive killed with just a mara.

Judging by your tremstats i'd say around 0.3

i have reinstalled trem many times so moot point, and tremstats don't define your skill.

I'm not trying to "define your skill"() here, tremstats are a rough but useful indication, unless the player in question has been going out of their way to play badly. Since we're discussing GPP here, a quick look at tremstats is interesting, what other names have you played as before you reinstalled trem?

[SirDude]

i cant tell you how many bases ive killed with just a mara.

Judging by your tremstats i'd say around 0.3

i have reinstalled trem many times so moot point, and tremstats don't define your skill.

I'm not trying to "define your skill"() here, tremstats are a rough but useful indication, unless the player in question has been going out of their way to play badly. Since we're discussing GPP here, a quick look at tremstats is interesting, what other names have you played as before you reinstalled trem?

when i say "Define my skill" im saying that trem stats doesn't tell you how truly good i am.
i reinstalled trem 3 times each time using the same name but i have found out that trem stats resets your stats when you reinstall. (BTW in totel i have been playing trem for 3 and a half years.)

[Tremulant]

I doubt that it resets, otherwise someone aliasing as you with a different guid would nuke your stats.

So, how truly good are you? you seem to be reporting a lot of trouble with gameplay basics lately.

[SirDude]

I doubt that it resets, otherwise someone aliasing as you with a different guid would nuke your stats.

So, how truly good are you? you seem to be reporting a lot of trouble with gameplay basics lately.

before i had PC issues a year ago, i was in EBSF under a different name for just a while, then i had PC issues and forgot about trem for a year, have been playing 1.2 for about 6 months now in total.

the gameplay issues i talk about are things i find are way to easy for me to do, even with other skilled players.

[Tremulant]

I doubt that it resets, otherwise someone aliasing as you with a different guid would nuke your stats.

So, how truly good are you? you seem to be reporting a lot of trouble with gameplay basics lately.

before i had PC issues a year ago, i was in EBSF under a different name for just a while, then i had PC issues and forgot about trem for a year, have been playing 1.2 for about 6 months now in total.

I'm afraid EBSF means absolutely nothing to me, sorry.

the gameplay issues i talk about are things i find are way to easy for me to do, even with other skilled players.

Things like building a decent base and dodging goons?

[SirDude]

I doubt that it resets, otherwise someone aliasing as you with a different guid would nuke your stats.

So, how truly good are you? you seem to be reporting a lot of trouble with gameplay basics lately.

before i had PC issues a year ago, i was in EBSF under a different name for just a while, then i had PC issues and forgot about trem for a year, have been playing 1.2 for about 6 months now in total.

I'm afraid EBSF means absolutely nothing to me, sorry.

the gameplay issues i talk about are things i find are way to easy for me to do, even with other skilled players.

Things like building a decent base and dodging goons?

lets just say that EBSF was one of if not THE most hardcore/hard to beat clan in the 1.1 era.

i feel that building super spread out bases is almost like the 1.1 turtle bases of 1.1, you know, in 1.1 the only bases that lasted were the compact turtle bases, and in GPP the only ones that last are the spread out kind, same kind of build concepts, just on different end of the extreme, I if feel that a mix of the 2 should be a option on most maps. IE maybe a few rets clumped to next to each other in key points to deal corner snipers or RC hops, but some spread out for general defenses that cant zapped.

i feel that in both 1.1 and GPP both have a devolved a "build this way or die" mindset to them, no room for mixing and that can easily discourage newer builders who don't get it at first.
that's what my turret idea is for, it a allows a mix of the 2 build styles but doesn't change how how the gameplay as a whole as much as a value change can.