Hungry for Tremulous 1.2?

[Belier13]

i know what a lucifer cannon is. were talking about the noob cannon.

"Noob Cannon" is the name given to the lucifer cannon when you start using it.
So basicly, we were talking about the Lucifer Cannon.

[n00b pl0x]

i know what a lucifer cannon is. were talking about the noob cannon.

"Noob Cannon" is the name given to the lucifer cannon when you start using it.
So basicly, we were talking about the Lucifer Cannon.

well thats dumb. i hate how people always think theyve made the greatest name for a weapon they hate by adding noob or tard to it >_>

[Norfenstein]

Slow down with the feedback?  I would have thought it would be welcome.  From what I have seen there has been very little, but I don't monitor the feedback forum too much.  Still, I would hope that the changes are not being made just for a select group of players.  That leads to a fragmentated community and empty servers.

Thoughtful feedback is welcome, but it's hard for me to take a criticism seriously when I know the person giving it hasn't experienced the issue in question for more than a handful of games on one server, with one set of players.

I wouldn't say the changes are "for" anyone, they're just the direction we (okay, you can blame me for most of the them) are taking. They can't not be for a "select group of players" because you can't please everyone, and we're not trying. I just got done playing a number of full games on tjw's server and really am optimistic about version 1.2, but I won't be at all offended if someone comes out with a "backport" of all the non-gameplay changes to 1.1 balance. We already have mods of Tremulous and as far as I can tell it hasn't hurt the community at all. The opposite, if anything.

[Diggs]

well thats dumb. i hate how people always think theyve made the greatest name for a weapon they hate by adding noob or tard to it >_>

The name has been around almost as long as Tremulous has.  There is nothing new about it.  It applies to the Lucifer because it is the first S3 weapon a noob will reach for.  It does the most amount of damage with the least amount of skill, hence noob cannon.  

"Me thinks thee protests too much."

[n00b pl0x]

It applies to the Lucifer because it is the first S3 weapon a noob will reach for.

It is the only s3 weapon a noob can reach for?

[AKAnotu]

actually, lucis can be good in the hands of an actually good player, don't consign them to oblivion

[Thorn]

To go back on-topic. I would have put the 1.2 changes up on Fun-zone, but unfortunately there is no already compiled version :/

[Diggs]

@Norfenstein  - I just got done playing a number of full games on tjw's server and really am optimistic about version 1.2, ...

Yes, I was there remember?  It was good to see that server full again, as we commented during the game, it reminds me of the old days.  I hope it continues.

[Ceaser342]

I can agree with most of the stuff but a few things need addressing.

The new turrets:  They don't help with camping.  A dretch can run into a human base and get 3 kills before the rets even turn around.  They are now pretty much useless.  This leaves you with Telsas.  Which only defend against anything dumb enough to run at them.   Plus you don't get them till s3.

Unlagged:  Good idea bad execution.  You need to lower its shot time and sensitivity. Mass driver is way to easy now.  Along with las gun.

Aliens are ****** if they arn't decent with the basi.  This adds a whole new element to noob.  You get a guy to evo to basi so what does he do?  Camp in base becuase he sucks.  Runs off and dies.  Or worse yet,  Doesn't evo at all!  Basically unless your now very skilled in base your a walking booster.

Alien regen after playing I can see its now quite as bad as I thought.  But it still hurts badly and forward eggs can very easily become feeders eggs.  I would rather see the regen transfered aura transferred to something like the Marauder.  Its a little more fortified.

[Evlesoa]

I agree...

My S3 tyrant got owned by a chaingun, and my Adv. Goon owned by a las gun I cant even get the fuck away, they all after me, god... Aliens = Shit they suck even at S3, I got owned by a Psaw because my tyrant cant hit, his range is so short... A psaw's range shouldnt be longer than a tyrants claw... And charge takes for ever...

If you looking for unbalanced gameplay, GO HERE!! Awesome mod for unbalanced game play, a dretch can own 3 turrets with no trying, because each time you are out of their sight, they restart their bootup, and they take like 2 seconds...

This pretty much turns aliens into shit... There are some nice additions, but otherwise the game has been ruined. Making the tyrant taller also ruins the game because the maps have to be taller somewhat... (Height) and not to mention, S3 should be owning S1, but its RARE and i mean REAL rare if the humans LOSE... humans almost never lose... ask the players, they know... Other then down-toning the aliens, its a nice mod... But you guys just OVER-Did it on the fixups...

[Xabiar]

I want to try 1.2 before I actually say anything...

[Lava Croft]

I want to try 1.2 before I actually say anything...

This not Tremulous 1.2. It's a mod for Tremulous 1.1.0 which is used by Norfenstein and TJW to figure out what changes to the Tremulous balance would be the best overall. I only posted this here because trem.tjw.org is empty most of the time, and I hoped that other server admins would hear me and also host a server to test the gameplay changes, which thankfully happened.

[Wormi]

So tremulous 1.2.0 will have only balance changes?

[Lava Croft]

So tremulous 1.2.0 will have only balance changes?

No, it will have flying Aliens, Medics and lots of maps with water.

[Shadowgandor]

Lol, you gotta be joking (although i hope not, flying aliens ftw), they already said flying aliens won't come in trem 1.2 but please correct me if i'm wrong

[Lakitu7]

A psaw's range shouldnt be longer than a tyrants claw...

+#define PAINSAW_RANGE               64.0f
+#define LEVEL4_CLAW_RANGE           116.0f

Um, okay dude. Sure. 116 is totally less than 64.

[Evlesoa]

Then why the fuck cant I hit a psaw?

Me and my friend tested this.

He stood next to me, at the max range of PSAW... He started sawing me, and I tried to swipe. Swiping didnt do anything... but the psaw killed me... so explain that!

We tried it the other way too

[Diggs]

The numbers Lakitu7 has posted I believe are the 1.1 default numbers.  You were trying the modded version?

(Correct me if I am wrong.)

[Lakitu7]

No. The old numbers are right next to the new ones, except with minus signs, because they've been removed and replaced by the lines with plus signs.

-#define PAINSAW_RANGE               40.0f
-#define LEVEL4_CLAW_RANGE           128.0f

Look for yourself. The file that you download when you connect to tjw's server is a .pk3. Copy it and rename to .zip. Then look at the .patch file in a text editor. It's right there, plain as day.

[Diggs]

Got it!

I stand corrected.

Thanks

[tjw]

I got owned by a Psaw because my tyrant cant hit, his range is so short... A psaw's range shouldnt be longer than a tyrants claw...

Range shouldn't be an issue, as Lakitu7 points out.  The reason tyrants are harder to hit with is more to do with the heavily narrowed "width"of their attack.  You need to aim much more accurately to hit anything.   This is kind of silly since there is no alien crosshair option yet, but please bear with us.

 And charge takes for ever...

You charge up for trample just as fast as before, the change is only that you can hold a fully changed trample longer before it automatically releases (for timing your fully charged trample attacks better).  This will make more sense once the appropriate ui element  is added.

If you looking for unbalanced gameplay, GO HERE!! Awesome mod for unbalanced game play

We're still making changes pretty often, but on the whole the balance we have been seeing in our limit testing seems quite good (88 human, 91 alien since the last g_tag bump) -->

http://tremulous.sourceforge.net/balance/tjw-lame_regen5/overall.png

Making the tyrant taller also ruins the game because the maps have to be taller somewhat...

The tyrant's bounding box height has not changed, only the viewheight so that it lines up better with the model.  It still isn't up where the head is since that's way out of the bounding box, but neck region is better than the belly-button-cam that it was.

Battle Suit however WILL have a taller model and this is something that may cause some issues with existing maps....

[ShadowNinjaDudeMan]

Flying aliens eh?
Big or small?
Cool.

Ive got a truck mod on-the-go.

[whitebear]

Is the orgin of the attack where tyrant views or from belly button? if orgin = view then range must be longer to reach the old destination and if orgin = belly button then aiming human head may actualy hit the feet if i am correct.

[Hk]

Well, I propose a change of those turrets.
The new turrets rule if big aliens attack. No big alien can stay in base long with those bastards around. However, they are not existent against dretches and other small stuff.

Thus, I say we need 2 types of turrets. The first one is the new turret from Trem 1.2, made to kill big stuff.

The other turret is the old turret, maybe weaker, with 2 or 3 damage.

Then, we have a weak rapidfireturret against all small things and a big beasty turret and a tesla against jumpers.

[temple]

Well, I propose a change of those turrets.
The new turrets rule if big aliens attack. No big alien can stay in base long with those bastards around. However, they are not existent against dretches and other small stuff.

Thus, I say we need 2 types of turrets. The first one is the new turret from Trem 1.2, made to kill big stuff.

The other turret is the old turret, maybe weaker, with 2 or 3 damage.

Then, we have a weak rapidfireturret against all small things and a big beasty turret and a tesla against jumpers.

So the base should defend itself?

[Plague Bringer]

Just get S3 (or S2 if tjw moves teslas to S2 *let us pray*) and build teslas. Teslas and the new turrets complement eachother fine.

[TriedtoDestroyMetal]

OH, PLEASE, just include MORE DEFAULT MAPS! Atcs is cute and all but GIVE IT A REST!
The temple for example, is frakking gorgeous!

[whitebear]

And where are you building alien base in that map?

[Hk]

So the base should defend itself?

show me a base surviving massive rant-attacks or good goons without humans.

[temple]

So the base should defend itself?

show me a base surviving massive rant-attacks or good goons without humans.

In 1.20
Pre-SD, very possible.  They take some damage, build rebuilds, the end.  Because the goons and the rants will take forever to regenerate unless they return to the base.