1.2 Gameplay Changes going off topic :)

[frazzler]

@ Devs of 1.2... Please, for the love of all that is hovel-shaped, stop trying to make things look and sound cool...WOAH A TURRET THAT RAPES GOON IN UNDER 3 SECS! I couldn't care less, it fucks up the gameplay. You've borked trem, as you have borked many players hearts. First you take for fucking ever to release 1.2, then when we all get to quench our anticipation, we find out what we've been waiting for sucks so much ass, that we go back to 1.1. Seriously d00ds, I'm not downloading 1.2, and I'm telling all my mates, that the devs are twats, cause they are. I don't want quicker, more retarded games. I liked 1.1, issues in 1.1 needed fixing. You fixed the issues, but you've made even more of them than you've solved.

What I'm trying to say is, you've fucked up one of the greatest games available. I know 1.1 is free, but for fucks sake. You should be paying ME to download 1.2, cause there's no other way I'm getting it.

[Plague Bringer]

@ Devs of 1.2... Please, for the love of all that is hovel-shaped, stop trying to make things look and sound cool...WOAH A TURRET THAT RAPES GOON IN UNDER 3 SECS! I couldn't care less, it fucks up the gameplay. You've borked trem, as you have borked many players hearts. First you take for fucking ever to release 1.2, then when we all get to quench our anticipation, we find out what we've been waiting for sucks so much ass, that we go back to 1.1. Seriously d00ds, I'm not downloading 1.2, and I'm telling all my mates, that the devs are twats, cause they are. I don't want quicker, more retarded games. I liked 1.1, issues in 1.1 needed fixing. You fixed the issues, but you've made even more of them than you've solved.

What I'm trying to say is, you've fucked up one of the greatest games available. I know 1.1 is free, but for fucks sake. You should be paying ME to download 1.2, cause there's no other way I'm getting it.

tl;dr
dear devs,
i'm on my period i hate you.


<3

[A Spork]

One Question:
Why did all of you wait until the devs were about to release 1.2, before you started freaking out?
There have been games on the dev servers for ages.

* A Spork smells troll

[your face]

We are realizing that it might actually get released.  We are the 1.2 protectors, trying to save it from utter disaster.

[A Spork]

It still would've made more sense once you saw a setting you didn't like in a dev game, to say then, not wait until they're practically done.

[Plague Bringer]

To be fair, we've been arguing against from the beginning.

[gimhael]

... and once we have a balance we all like ...

Wishful thinking ?

I don't think the devs will start the balance testing all over because of some complaints here. After all it's their game.

If you want to influence the way the game develops, you have to contribute, that's how open source works. It doesn't mean you have to code or map or model something, but testing and giving feedback is also contributing. The 1.1 code will not disappear and if someone cares enough to actually work on it, there will be a 1.1 on 1.2 mod in a few weeks. (It doesn't need testing as it is already perfectly balanced, so it should be quick to make.)

[amz181]

To be fair, we've been arguing against from the beginning.

to be honest, i felt like i was the only one who didnt like the changes. Noone else shared my views, or atleast, noone posted views similar to mine.

[amz181]

... and once we have a balance we all like ...

Wishful thinking ?

I don't think the devs will start the balance testing all over because of some complaints here. After all it's their game.

If you want to influence the way the game develops, you have to contribute, that's how open source works. It doesn't mean you have to code or map or model something, but testing and giving feedback is also contributing. The 1.1 code will not disappear and if someone cares enough to actually work on it, there will be a 1.1 on 1.2 mod in a few weeks. (It doesn't need testing as it is already perfectly balanced, so it should be quick to make.)

Well maybe, what we can all bare. Im thinking 1.1 with minor changes to gameplay, e.g. nerfing the rant a smidge.

And i think our complaints will work, but i wouldnt be surprised if the devs are mightily peed off right now, because to be honest, none of you guys ever have given feedback till now, so thats essentially half a years (more or less) work gone.

But still, i doubt the devs would release something which is being so hotly opposed.

[{7}wrath]

I think the changes should be limited to the following:

   * General
         o marked deconstruction
               + instead of instantly removing structures, deconstruct will now mark them as no longer needed
               + marked structures will be automatically removed when more build points are needed or when a marked structure is blocking the placement of a new structure
               + when reclaiming build points for a new structure, the first marked structure of the same type will be taken down; if none are marked, structures will be taken down in the order they were marked
               + unpowered human structures will be removed immediately instead of marked (since they use no build points to be reclaimed)
               + g_markedDeconstruct
                     # 0 - disable marking, structures are removed immediately (no build timer penalty)
                     # 1 - can't build over marked structures
                     # 2 - can only build structures of the same type over marked structures
                     # 3 (default) - no restriction on building over marked structures
         o new votes
               + nextmap - sets the next map without ending the current one
               + sudden_death - starts sudden death after g_suddenDeathVoteDelay seconds (default 180), requires g_suddenDeathVotePercent to pass (default 74, set to 0 to disable SD voting)
         o funds are kept when switching teams (and converted appropriately)
         o g_dretchPunt - dretches get knocked back by alien attacks (does no damage when friendly fire is on)
         o say_area - send a message to teammates within g_sayAreaRange (default 1000)
         o build timers now match up with structure build times
               + was: 17/12/17.5/15 seconds for all structures (double for Overmind/Reactor) built by a granger/advanced granger/construction kit/advanced construction kit
               + the HUD indicator is now 2.5 seconds per slice for both teams
   * Aliens
   * Dragoon
         o advanced
               + same size as regular
   * Tyrant
         o view height increased 35 -> 64
         o healing aura removed
         o health reduced 400 -> 350
         o crush attack
               + damages humans and human structures when falling on top of them
               + 120 + half falling velocity nonlocational damage, 500 repeat (only repeats for players, not structures)
         o trample and crush never damage teammates/friendly structures, even with friendly fire on
   * Barricade
         o cost reduced 10 -> 8
         o health increased 200 -> 300
         o death splash radius increased 50 -> 100
         o shrink when aliens try to jump over
   * Hovel
         o STAYS GODDAMMIT
   * Humans
         o jump stamina cost reduced 500 -> 250
         o firing an empty weapon makes a clicking noise (audible to aliens)
   * Construction Kit
         o removed Advanced Construction Kit (regular kit now builds everything that's available)
         o repairing is done automatically when possible, without needing to press a button
         o deconstructing unpowered structures will immediately remove them, instead of marking them for deconstruction
   * Flamethrower
         o projectile speed increased 200 -> 300
         o projectile lifetime reduced 800 -> 700
         o muzzle offset lowered (can now fire in vents without self-immolating)
   * Battlesuit
         o viewheight increased 26 -> 29
   * Tesla
         o no longer require defense computers
         o fires from the top of its bounding box to the top of its target's bounding box (can now fire over turrets)
   * Defense Computer
         o no longer affects turrets
         o no longer required for teslas
         o repairs structures in its range 3 health per second, with a 2 second delay after taking damage (this effect stacks with multiple DCs)
         o range reduced 10000 -> 1000 (range affects what structures it heals and warns about)
         o fixed a bug that broke defense computers when built farther from the map origin than their r
   * Medistation
         o restores 30 stamina per 100ms
         o cures poison to anyone that touches one regardless of who is being healed

[temple]

One Question:
Why did all of you wait until the devs were about to release 1.2, before you started freaking out?
There have been games on the dev servers for ages.

* A Spork smells troll

I did, we argued about unlagged, we argued about alien regeneration, people complained about basilisks, mara zap changed about a million times, the RC used to be a weapon when you built a DCC, marked decon, etc....

Only in the past few months did a lot of the subtle human changes happen.  At first it was flamers, unlagged, and stamina.   Right around the time that cades got changed to shrink did a lot of these things really start rolling.  But this is the big problem....the changes were all done piecemeal and in the 1.2 Developer game server thread.  So, you would hear 'This one thing was changed' then a few weeks later 'something else was changed'.  The overall changes were never posted in full until recently.

[{7}wrath]

Plus, there was the fact that Norf said that the changes were nearly final. I think that's what pissed a lot of people off.

[SlackerLinux]

   * Hovel
         o STAYS GODDAMMIT

here is what this section should say

    * Hovel
          o STAYS GODDAMMIT. i like glitching through map walls and i like other players doing it too. its epic awesome to glitchbuild a om in an unreachable place add a few spawns and you cant lose!!!!111

as you can see it was removed for a reason the only way id like it back is if they took away the aspect that allowed people to glitch with it(granger hiding) which pretty much turns it into a useless free barricade

[Tremulant]

I'm wondering if i've just imagined all the discussion and open access to dev games, and mgdev was, infact, kept in a locked filing cabinet, in a disused toilet bearing the sign "Beware of the leopard" until recently...

One Question:
Why did all of you wait until the devs were about to release 1.2, before you started freaking out?
There have been games on the dev servers for ages.

* A Spork smells troll

[{7}wrath]

as you can see it was removed for a reason the only way id like it back is if they took away the aspect that allowed people to glitch with it(granger hiding) which pretty much turns it into a useless free barricade

Touche. Idk if it's worth removing, though. 

[Ryanw4390]

Hovel should have never been taken away. Up until then I was living with the changes.

[Amanieu]

Hovel glitch-building has been fixed

[gimhael]

I think the current hovel is useless, but if you change into a dretch cannon....

[your face]

Granger. Granger cannon!  

[SlackerLinux]

Hovel glitch-building has been fixed

till a new way is discovered yeh most is fixed but that buildable is far more hassle then it is useful imho

[Ryanw4390]

Hovel is useless because you can only build one of them. Make them like 8bp and barricades 12-16bp that way grangers have more than one place to hide during an attack!

[Grape]

>< just did an interclan on the dev server and it was really fun! 

[HellsAngelz]

I've had years and years and decades and generations of experience of playing Tremulous...also known as about 9 months.

I believe most of the "pro's" don't like the change because let's face it, now they need to adapt to a new kind of gameplay and basically completely change the way they play.
In 1.2 you'll need to learn (partially or completely)

New ways to aim(due to some hitboxes becoming smaller/larger, and vertical/horizontal slash areas are more/less.)
New ways to dodge, especially due to the new +button8 addition.
New ways to be a team (changes in weapons, such as md, might make md the new and powerful scrim tool for humans.)
New ways to use classes, meaning some aliens have become more powerful of a sort, and some have become weakened. (Mara is now easier to use, basi has less hp but regen ability.)
and many other things my inexperienced brain can't think of at the moment.

I think the pro's of 1.1 don't like the fact they might need to catch up to the noobs of 1.2.
My suggestion? You can host your own server and run 1.1, but i'm sure the population will die, and only 30 or so people will continue playing.
Or you can play the dev games right now, and when 1.2 is released, show us you're the true gamers of Tremulous and work your fucking ass off to become pros at THIS new style of gameplay.
Btw devs, you really need to work on making porn.

[Repatition]

so true.......it will be a change but worth it totaly!

[Plague Bringer]

Hells, Tremulous 1.1 is a perfectly good game. Tremulous 1.2 is a DIFFERENT GAME. We don't want to play H3, we want to play COD4.

[frazzler]

I've said it from the beginning, 1.2 is a myth, like masturbation makes you go blind, or Kevlarman is manly. Once I found out that 1.2 was real, I thought it neccessary to promply stuff every dev into a chuhuahua's asshole, then put that chuhuahua into a car compactor, take that chuhuahua-cube, and stick that cube in a blender. Once sufficiently puree'd I fed the pulp to my dog, who threw it back up, ate it again, shat it out, ate it again, then vomited it back up again. I then sent that vomit to the sun.

[N-Ron]

>< just did an interclan on the dev server and it was really fun!  

[Senor Bobbers]

lol hi guys i have a different opinion wanna be friends

[Grape]

>< just did an interclan on the dev server and it was really fun!  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rkz5eq-nqDQ

[E-Mxp]

So many people demanding the hovel! Isnt it a good idea to have the hovel model included in the game, but disabled in 1.2 games? That way people who want the hovel can start a server with the hovel included (free barricade/hovelport/to hide in). Or for modders to have an extra model to do something with.

If this is already the case then ignore this post